Hitler's Hidden Holocaust

[MikeWaters]

This is a program by Nat Geo, about the Einsatzgruppen. I had heard of this show on NPR, can't remember which NPR program. But the gist was that we only hear about the death camps, and primarily Auschwitz. What we don't hear about are the many that were killed by Hitler's goons, methodologically, with guns. And much earlier than the death camps.

I recorded the show tonight. Watched the first part. One of the German soldiers took pictures. The pictures I saw were of belongings and a group of people (Jews) that were rounded up, and were to be killed in hours. A picture of some knitted mittens, with a string tied between the two, raised the hairs on my neck. Then the pictures of adults holding beautiful children. It is hard to see this.

I will finish the program later. I will watch it. I owe that much to them. To remember them, and tell their story, in the limited way I can.

Evil people do not know that they are evil. No one tells them. They think they are perfectly justified and quite normal in their understanding of the world.

In my fantasy, I go back in time, and I give a million black rifles to the Jews, gypsies, the homosexuals, the undesirables, and I wage war, terrible war. But maybe the Prince of Darkness laughs and eggs me on.

Maybe, like lambs to the slaughter, they did it better. They stood as testament to evil. They witnessed with their lives, the stark contrast of innocence to darkness.

Perhaps God raised some men to die. But maybe he raised some men to kill. In memory of our God, our religion, and freedom, and our peace, our wives, and our children.

What shall we do? The little things. Get to know our neighbors. Build trust in our communities. Get involved in local politics. Work to make our little place in this world better. My Jewish friend, much older than me said this: "I have a lot of respect for Mormons. Like Jews, they believe the world can be redeemed."

It's hard to look at photos of genocide and believe the world can be redeemed. But what choice do we have?

[MikeWaters]

I finished watching this yesterday.

I recommend it seeing it. I recommend reflecting on it. National Geographic Channel.

[BlueK]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

I finished watching this yesterday.

I recommend it seeing it. I recommend reflecting on it. National Geographic Channel.

I don't think the holocaust was as hidden from the Germans as they like to say it was. Seriously, you had to have been a total idiot not to understand that the Nazis hated Jews and were acting on that hate or that your Jewish neighbors were rounded up and taken somewhere. Hitler talked openly about "solving" the "Jewish problem." and the SS types were known to talk and boast about many things. You had to be a Nazi fanatic to be taken into the SS, so they would have had no problem boasting of what they were doing to Jews. For regular Germans to say they knew nothing I think is mostly a copout. The fact is, like with most brutal totalitarian regimes, everyone was too scared to say what they were thinking because they knew anyone who did speak out would be taken away like their Jewish neighbors were and either executed or sent to a concentration camp. That makes actions by those like Helmuth Huebner seem even more heroic. Naive perhaps, but certainly heroic.

[MikeWaters]

In the context of this particular documentary, "hidden" refers to the current public's general ignorance of the killings that preceded the death camps.

The Nazis did not hide the fact they will killing Jews and others. People came out to watch, they took pictures. Like a public hanging. But instead, it was naked people being shot in pits.

Later on, when it became apparent they were going to lose the war, some of the Einsatzgruppen were assigned to destroy evidence of the mass killings. So they went back to the mass graves and began destroying the bodies, through intensive burning with a device they designed.

I think the Nazis and SS actually got off pretty easy for what they did.

Turnabout is fair play. I think if you have killed 1.5 million men, women, and children, and then you lose the war--you should not complain very much if you yourself are executed (let's leave the complaining to liberal lawyers in Seattle). In fact, you should be pretty grateful that your children aren't executed in front of you, I would think.

Lots of people have done evil things and never suffered punishment. Mountain Meadows Massacre as an example. Here you had an entire community of church-going Mormons who had committed mass murder in secret. They lived their lives.

If you don't personally draw a line for yourself, stop, and face possibly severe consequences, then you may find yourself dragged down into moral abomination. In some cases, you have to be willing to die for your own belief in the good. Because the people around you may kill you for not participating. My point is, that we must guard against the kind of institutional evil that led to the Nazi atrocities. And lest you think it is impossible for a Mormon community of believers to do the same, I point you to MMM. Probably mostly good people gone horribly astray. You have to guard against you yourself going astray.

Look at Jay Bybee. Probably not so different than your average, decent Mormon. How did he go from that, to being the posterboy for torture? Lack of courage, that's how. Doing what the bosses bid.

[BlueK]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

In the context of this particular documentary, "hidden" refers to the current public's general ignorance of the killings that preceded the death camps.

The Nazis did not hide the fact they will killing Jews and others. People came out to watch, they took pictures. Like a public hanging. But instead, it was naked people being shot in pits.

Later on, when it became apparent they were going to lose the war, some of the Einsatzgruppen were assigned to destroy evidence of the mass killings. So they went back to the mass graves and began destroying the bodies, through intensive burning with a device they designed.

I think the Nazis and SS actually got off pretty easy for what they did.

Turnabout is fair play. I think if you have killed 1.5 million men, women, and children, and then you lose the war--you should not complain very much if you yourself are executed (let's leave the complaining to liberal lawyers in Seattle). In fact, you should be pretty grateful that your children aren't executed in front of you, I would think.

Lots of people have done evil things and never suffered punishment. Mountain Meadows Massacre as an example. Here you had an entire community of church-going Mormons who had committed mass murder in secret. They lived their lives.

If you don't personally draw a line for yourself, stop, and face possibly severe consequences, then you may find yourself dragged down into moral abomination. In some cases, you have to be willing to die for your own belief in the good. Because the people around you may kill you for not participating. My point is, that we must guard against the kind of institutional evil that led to the Nazi atrocities. And lest you think it is impossible for a Mormon community of believers to do the same, I point you to MMM. Probably mostly good people gone horribly astray. You have to guard against you yourself going astray.

Look at Jay Bybee. Probably not so different than your average, decent Mormon. How did he go from that, to being the posterboy for torture? Lack of courage, that's how. Doing what the bosses bid.

Major motion picture about Helmuth Huebner being filmed now. I hope it's good:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0880494/

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by BlueK

Major motion picture about Helmuth Huebner being filmed now. I hope it's good:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0880494/

How bad can it be? It's from the Work and Glory screenwriter...

Which tells me that it's probably going to be marketed as a regional film???

[BlueK]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

How bad can it be? It's from the Work and Glory screenwriter...

Which tells me that it's probably going to be marketed as a regional film???

The LDS aspect isn't central to the story, so it would appeal to a general audience.

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by BlueK

The LDS aspect isn't central to the story, so it would appeal to a general audience.

Was gary coleman not available?

[SeattleUte]

If you want to see a documentary for the ages on the holoicaust watch Shoah. If you want to feel some vengeful satisfaction (the kind of high you get from the death penalty) check out Downfall. It's my favorite movie all-time.

Lately I've been reading about the "evacuation" of the Jews from Hungary. If you want to really test your faith in human nature this is a worthwhile subject to undertake. Spring 1944. A rational person would have thought the Germans had as good as lost the war. The Germans "invaded" Hungary, ostensibly an ally. Probably this was motivated by desperate need for personnel to man their armament factories, as slaves. But Adolph Eichmann took control of the chaotic and disorganized German occupation. He sent about 500,000 Jews not to slave labor, but to the gas chambers and crematoria at Auschwitz. Eichmann has been called the ultimate personification of the banality of evil. He did it just for turf war; it has been said he might just as well have been a superb middle manager at an auto manufacturing plant. Jews were his stock in trade. A means to power and influence and success.

The Hungarian Jews went willingly, duped into believing they were being resettled in remote places, like Indian reservations. This all happened through mid-1944, even after the Normandy landings. The Hungarian government eagerly handed them over. Two prominent Jews, Rudoph Kastner, an elegant Hungarian lawyer, and Joel Brant, an "adventurer," negotiated with the Nazis to save a select few of the Jews. Apparently Eichmann, in exchange for huge payments, permitted a few thousand Jews to be released on the "Kastner train" to Switzerland. These were mostly intellectuals and movers and shakers, as well as the super rich among Hungarian Jews who donated money to buy seats on the train for hand picked Jews who could not afford one.

After the war, Kastner moved to Israel and became a prominent pundit and politician. But a fellow Israeli self-published a pamphlet accusing Kastner of collaboration with the SS. The Israeli government brought a criminal libel charge against the publisher (these laws exist in most western democracies, but not in the U.S.; something to admire about our country). The defendant was acquitted and the judge, in his opinion, said that Kastner "sold his soul to the devil." He then retired from public life and lived as a recluse, and his wife became hopelessly depressed and bed bound. The Israel Supreme Court overturned the libel decision, and vindicated him, but not until after he was assassinated by Zionist extremists. I'm sure he was no saint, but he never asked to have to play God that way.

[MikeWaters]

I might just catch Inglorious Basterds instead.