The Church on the Wrong Side of History Again

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by Cougar Hunter

http://mormonsfor8.com/

Looks like a gentleman that I taught the discussions to donated $50,000.

How does the downline thing work? What's my cut of that?

you and he will burn in hell together because of his hatred. That's how it works.

[Cougar Hunter]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

you and he will burn in hell together because of his hatred. That's how it works.

But I currently own 2 Macs and have had several others, and 3 or 4 iPods. So maybe that will help even it out.

[All-American]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

Well, as AA will tell you, modernism began with Darwin, so I don't know if that's exactly true.

Oh, you give me too much credit.

Two of the most significant thinkers of the period were, in biology, Charles Darwin, and in political science, Karl Marx. Darwin's theory of evolution by natural selection undermined the religious certainty of the general public, and the sense of human uniqueness of the intelligentsia. The notion that human beings were driven by the same impulses as "lower animals" proved to be difficult to reconcile with the idea of an ennobling spirituality. Karl Marx seemed to present a political version of the same proposition: that problems with the economic order were not transient, the result of specific wrong doers or temporary conditions, but were fundamentally contradictions within the "capitalist" system. Both thinkers would spawn defenders and schools of thought that would become decisive in establishing modernism.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modernism

[All-American]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

Before AA jumps all over me, let me correct. Frankenstein was more near the summit rather than the start of the romatic period.

Please rest assured that I have very little interest in jumping all over you.

[il Padrino Ute]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

you and he will burn in hell together because of his hatred. That's how it works.

You should be glad, as you will have company.

[Sleeping in EQ]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

Well, as AA will tell you, modernism began with Darwin, so I don't know if that's exactly true. But it makes sense to me. To every action there's a reaction; opposites attract; opposition in all things; thesis antithesis, that kind of stuff. Modernism and the romantic period overlapped as well. The romantic movements--in which I include postmodernism--are intelligent, highly creative nostalgic responses to the Enlightenment and modernism.

But as I posted yesterday, it's really apples and oranges, and the Enlightenment/modernism is not incompatible with Romaticism/postmodernism. Tolstoy and Cormac McCarthy have lived in both worlds. That's what the latter movements are all about, really, adding back mystery to the nothingness, the ultimate despair, and final annihilation represeneted by science, particularly natural selection. This is the soil of our greatest artistic and philosophical achievements.

Religion is a cruder reaction, but born of similar longing. Facsism is a dark mutation, an evil mutant spawn of religion and Romanticism.

Fascism has everything to do with the desire to be led, and is not religion-specific. Lewis Mumford and Gilles Deleuze demonstrate how fascism is connected to order, technology, and modernity.

Contemporary religion has everything to do with modernism (ala Weber and Foucault). Today's fundamentalistic religion is a reaction to modernity, not its "crude" predecessor. In what sense is religion more "crude" than postmodern romanticism? They aren't even mutually exclusive or conceptually parallel.

Perhaps you mean that fundamentalism is a kind of dark romanticism.

That idea might have merit.

[Solon]

Originally Posted by Solon

Has the LDS church really donated $19 million to fight prop. 8? Or is this money LDS members have contributed?

It looks like Prop. 8 is getting closer to receiving official LDS funds.

http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_10842051

I consider "in-kind" to be the same as cash donations, but I'm not sure if the tax-man does.

[HuskyFreeNorthwest]

Originally Posted by il Padrino Ute

He's a guy who may or may not be real.

Mike Waters is very real, I have mailed him things before.

[BarbaraGordon]

Originally Posted by il Padrino Ute

He's a guy who may or may not be real.

He's as real as any of the rest of us.

[Gidget]

I'm late on this one (as usual, my day job as a mother must be very busy or something) but I read the article and felt myself feeling "yeah stick it to 'em Joe" but then logic (submissive blind lamb) took over and I was left with guilt. Which makes me realize that I am SO on the fence on this issue, and doesn't the Bible say that is the worst place to be? I feel positively green and two years old when I think of Prop 8. I consider myself an intelligent person with strong opinions and I can't tell if I am just shaken that this one isn't so strong or if I am experiencing that LDS leadership guilt mongering thing. Probably both. I am sad and confused at the church's obnoxious outpouring of support for Prop 8 combined with their lack of even a small mention to many other national/international political atrocities. And as lame as this sounds, I don't know what that means for my testimony. I still feel like the Church is true. Have no plans to leave ever - is anyone else experiencing this awkward volley?