How many times are we going to shock this patient

[MikeWaters]

and bring it back to life, before we realize it's terminal and is going to die no matter how much effort we put in?

$14 billion here, another 20 billion there, then what? Good money after bad.

Why is everyone so afraid of a quick death? Is the slightly longer more-drawn out expensive death so much more satisfying?

Are we to believe that no backs are getting scratched as billions of tax payer dollars go to these companies? LOL.

It's sickening.

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

and bring it back to life, before we realize it's terminal and is going to die no matter how much effort we put in?

$14 billion here, another 20 billion there, then what? Good money after bad.

Why is everyone so afraid of a quick death? Is the slightly longer more-drawn out expensive death so much more satisfying?

Are we to believe that no backs are getting scratched as billions of tax payer dollars go to these companies? LOL.

It's sickening.

I agree. But let me ask you. Does it bother you if we have no manufacturing base? Like Ecuador. It kind of does me.

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

I agree. But let me ask you. Does it bother you if we have no manufacturing base? Like Ecuador. It kind of does me.

this is a little bit like a divorce. what bothers you more? the act of divorce, or all the things that led up to the divorce?

A friend told me once, divorce is nothing but a death certificate. It's an official proclamation of something that has already occurred.

Propping up failed companies doesn't allow new American companies to be born.

[Levin]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

and bring it back to life, before we realize it's terminal and is going to die no matter how much effort we put in?

$14 billion here, another 20 billion there, then what? Good money after bad.

Why is everyone so afraid of a quick death? Is the slightly longer more-drawn out expensive death so much more satisfying?

Are we to believe that no backs are getting scratched as billions of tax payer dollars go to these companies? LOL.

It's sickening.

This seems to describe how we care for our dying elderly as well. We spend our health care dollars to give old people with no quality of life an extra six months to live. Just as we should let the dying die (as they do in Britain), we should let the dying die here.

There would be much that would rise from the ashes; ashes are nutritious. They're the fertilzer of the forests (and were the fertilizer of the Great Plains). Experience tells us they're aslo the fertilizer for capitalism.

[ute4ever]

I didn't want a new car, and can't afford one, but yesterday the government forced me to buy one anyway; however, when I look out in the driveway, I see the same 10-year-old dented Toyota as before.

Awesome.

I wonder how many golden parachutes my pretend car just helped to sew.

[Ma'ake]

So we let GM, Ford & Chrysler die.

If we got into a war situation, or some other national emergency, we can count on Toyota to build tanks for us, right?

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by Ma'ake

So we let GM, Ford & Chrysler die.

If we got into a war situation, or some other national emergency, we can count on Toyota to build tanks for us, right?

First off, Ford says it doesn't need any money.

Liberals indulging in Corporate (i.e. Union) welfare. So predictable.

[Venkman]

Originally Posted by Ma'ake

So we let GM, Ford & Chrysler die.

If we got into a war situation, or some other national emergency, we can count on Toyota to build tanks for us, right?

Yes, it's disappointing.

What is ironic is that they are about to die just as they are becoming viable, thanks to the shenanigans of assholes on Wall Street who our fine elected representatives had no problem giving tens of billions to, no strings attached. The new UAW contract set for 2010 would put their wages closer in line with the Japanese, and they have pretty much caught up on quality (although interior materials are still cheaper).

What ticks me off about the GOP lawmakers is that they refuse to acknowlege that while the Big 3 have really FUBAR'd things up in the past, they've made great strides in the past five years or so with quality, costs, etc. I mean, I've generally agreed with their approach, which was essentially bankruptcy type restructuring, but without the Chapter 11, but to hear them trash the auto industry as a worthless piece of crap while throwing billions to Wall Street without batting an eye kind of ticked me off.

And let's be honest. We can talk lassiez faire all we want, but the reality is that foreign automakers get ALOT of help/subsidies from their governments. The Japanese got buttloads of taxbreaks by southern states to build factories there. Then there's all the onerous regulation we place on our auto makers. Small cars actually make money in Europe and both Ford and GM make great small cars over there but they can't import to the U.S. because of some enviro regulation or other nonsense. (They're good enough for Europe's standards, but not ours? Really?) I could go on and on. Our automakers have been fighting with one hand tied behind their backs, thanks to our government.

Finally, the UAW was stupid not to cave to the GOP. The jig is up for them, bankruptcy or not, but they'll for sure lose more jobs under Chap 11, hell, maybe all of them. Idiots. They've killed the golden goose. I don't have any sympathy for them. If there's any justice, GM will emerge from Chap 11 sans union.