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Old 04-11-2007, 10:13 PM   #11
Detroitdad
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Being evil is part of the job description of a prosecutor.
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Old 04-11-2007, 10:30 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by creekster View Post
This will sound hokey and hard to believe, but when I worked in the PD office I honestly felt like I was the last bastion of liberty in the criminal justice system. Most of my clients were low-lifes and reprobates and probably deserved punishment for something if not for the particular crime of which they were accused. No one looked out for them and no one wanted to help them and the cops were frequently sloppy or 'creative' in their reports and claims and yet no one cared and the DAs seemed to only worry about win/loss percentage. If the PD didn't protect the rights of these people, no one would and if this class of people was lost to the rights in our system, how long would it be before those abuses creep upward to the rest of us? You don't need evil DAs for this to happen, you only need zealousness, and the DAs frequently have more zeal than they have sense. So even though SU and Arch poke sly fun at the notion, I think we ALL owe a debt to PDs and the work they do (and the pay SUCKS).

I am grateful for the criminal defense bar and especially for the PDs. They perform an invaluable service. I agree absolutely that it is essential beyond imagination that we continue to assure civil protections and liberties, even to the lowest of the low, lest the remainder of society be caught off guard with nobody to protect them. Thankfully, most lay persons don't have to worry because of the good work of our defense bar. Bless them.
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Old 04-12-2007, 12:24 AM   #13
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The outcome of the Duke Lacrosse case lends credence to the idea that prosecutors are, as a class, evil. A necessary evil, but evil all the same. As one who places paramount importance on liberty, I tend to subscribe to that notion as a prophylactic measure if nothing else. Voracious ambition, evangelism, and the awesome power and limitless finances of the state are a scary combination. If one of my sons were involved in this, after I cuffed him up side the head I'd try to strangle the prosecutor with my bare hands. It will be fun to see if the original DA on the case gets disbarred.

Cue UtahDan to come in and correct my facts.
Man people must think I'm arrogant. I would not presume to correct your facts.

I will add the following observations:

Most prosecutors that I know don't exercise their discretion as often as they should. It is an important part of the job to be able to say "you know, I'm just not pursuing that." Luckily, the office I work the most closely with is great in this area though as a citizen and not defense counsel there are areas I wish they were stronger.

The larger the city, the more ambitious prosecutors you run in to. The ones who are really trying to make their bones are tougher to deal with because they are focused on getting the conviction. I don't think they are evil, but some of them have the primary goal of advancing their careers politcally.

Maybe the biggest problem with prosecutors is that they don't have a client. They don't truly answer to anyone. This leads to less than rational decisions at times. They also get so used to winning (because most people are guilty and have no techincal defenses and frankly becasue most people who are represented are represented by lawyers on the court appointed list who are rarely all-stars) that they are a little arrogant and act like they are supposed to win and that the last thing you want to do is try your case. That's okay with me because I learned early never to be afraid to put your case in front of the court. Plus I love trying criminal cases.

I don't have an illusions about doing something overly noble by doing defense. I'm not on the court appointed list so all my clients are at least well off enough to pay me. The main role I think I play is being on the front line of where the 4th, 5th and 6th amendment meet the road. The police in trying to do their job will try to push the envelope and in many cases run over people's rights. If there was no one there to suppress their evidence when they screw up it would only get worse. Cops have to learn the right way to do things and should be punished for overreaching by seeing their cases go away. I have a great relationship with most of the cops I know locally. I always treat them with respect and in many cases offer to give them a copy of the case I cited and tell them how they could have done it right. Most of them take you right up on that offer. As defense counsel I want to give my people the best defense I can, but as a citizen of where I live I want the police to catch the bad guys and do it in a way that the convinctions stick.
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Old 04-12-2007, 01:50 AM   #14
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I worked with a defense attorney during law school and I came out with a general negative impression of local prosecutors. Overcharge and underplea was their MO as it saved time, money and they still got to count the prosecution. The defendants were terribly afraid of getting locked up for life and they jumped at the first sign of a deal. This was especially prevelant among court appointed cases we would get.
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Old 04-12-2007, 02:03 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by SeattleUte View Post
The outcome of the Duke Lacrosse case lends credence to the idea that prosecutors are, as a class, evil. A necessary evil, but evil all the same. As one who places paramount importance on liberty, I tend to subscribe to that notion as a prophylactic measure if nothing else. Voracious ambition, evangelism, and the awesome power and limitless finances of the state are a scary combination. If one of my sons were involved in this, after I cuffed him up side the head I'd try to strangle the prosecutor with my bare hands. It will be fun to see if the original DA on the case gets disbarred.

Cue UtahDan to come in and correct my facts.
I agree. Prosecutors will lie, cheat, exagerate, ignore the evidence, falsify evidence, mislead, manipulate, and anything else to win their cases. So will the defense attorneys. The poor judges are left to sift through the bullshit.
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Old 04-12-2007, 02:09 AM   #16
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Thank goodness for prosecutors; without them the criminals would run free while the law abiding citizens would have no defenders.
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Old 04-12-2007, 02:14 AM   #17
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Thank goodness for prosecutors; without them the criminals would run free while the law abiding citizens would have no defenders.
They are necessary and there are some good ones, but it is troubling to see how many of them abuse their authority.
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Old 04-12-2007, 02:17 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by jay santos View Post
I agree. Prosecutors will lie, cheat, exagerate, ignore the evidence, falsify evidence, mislead, manipulate, and anything else to win their cases. So will the defense attorneys. The poor judges are left to sift through the bullshit.
That is WAY overstating things. People watch too much TV.
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Old 04-12-2007, 02:18 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by il Padrino Ute View Post
Thank goodness for prosecutors; without them the criminals would run free while the law abiding citizens would have no defenders.
Fair but exaggerated point. There are good prosecutors, but if not checked by defense attorneys abusive practices woudl very, very quickly overwhlem the cjs.
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Old 04-12-2007, 02:20 AM   #20
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They are necessary and there are some good ones, but it is troubling to see how many of them abuse their authority.
I can agree with this, though not being an attorney or criminal, I haven't dealt with them at all, so I'll have to concede that others know more than I.

I just find it interesting that it is defense attorneys - the professional rival of the prosecutor - who tell us that prosecutors are evil, so I tend to believe that they're not as bad as they'd have us believe.

BTW - what did the prosecutor in the Duke lacrosse team do that was so evil? Anyone? I didn't follow it because I don't care about Duke lacrosse.
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