I am still shocked at the AIDS numbers I see

[Cali Coug]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061128/..._global_deaths

Much of the problem of AIDS is related to homophobia among the general public and the sentiment that AIDS victims "deserve" what they get.

Nobody deserves AIDS. It is awful, and the problem is getting worse.

[UtahDan]

Originally Posted by hoyacoug

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061128/..._global_deaths

Much of the problem of AIDS is related to homophobia among the general public and the sentiment that AIDS victims "deserve" what they get.

Nobody deserves AIDS. It is awful, and the problem is getting worse.

And here I thought that AIDS was related to unprotected sex and needle sharing. Turns out it is homophobia that is to blame!

I agree that no one deserves AIDS and we should try to find a cure, but my sense is that the ongoing research there is well financed. I also don't think that anyone deserves cirrhosis of the liver and yet I wouldn't put an alcoholic at the top of the transplant list.

I guess if I'm really being honest, I am somewhat indifferent to the plight of most people, not just AIDS victims, who engage in risky behavior and then experience the consequences. Agreed that contracting AIDS is a steep price to pay from an ill advised sexual encounter but so is 18 years is child support. Being suddenly much flatter and wider seems like a disproportionate penalty for packing your parachute incorrectly, but then jumping out of airplanes is a risky thing to do.

I care basically about the children who are born with it through no fault of their own and for that reason am very much in favor of all the efforts to cure it and prevent it. If the secondary beneficiaries of that are adults who contract it because of risky behavior that is fine as well.

In the end I disagree that there is a homophobia issue at play here at this point though I believe there once was. I think it has more to do with the fact that most people contract it through risky behavior (or so it is percieved) and a lot of people are pretty indifferent to that.

[RockyBalboa]

Heaven forbid people wear condoms and quit sharing drug needles.

EASILY Preventable behaviors that lead to the MAJORITY of the problem.

Of course this is where liberals take those comments as saying that people who share the sentiment of prevention are saying those who get the disease earned it.

They have an incredible ability to read something and then lie about the what they've just read to convince themselves of factually incorrect thought processes.

[Cali Coug]

Originally Posted by UtahDan

And here I thought that AIDS was related to unprotected sex and needle sharing. Turns out it is homophobia that is to blame!

I agree that no one deserves AIDS and we should try to find a cure, but my sense is that the ongoing research there is well financed. I also don't think that anyone deserves cirrhosis of the liver and yet I wouldn't put an alcoholic at the top of the transplant list.

I guess if I'm really being honest, I am somewhat indifferent to the plight of most people, not just AIDS victims, who engage in risky behavior and then experience the consequences. Agreed that contracting AIDS is a steep price to pay from an ill advised sexual encounter but so is 18 years is child support. Being suddenly much flatter and wider seems like a disproportionate penalty for packing your parachute incorrectly, but then jumping out of airplanes is a risky thing to do.

I care basically about the children who are born with it through no fault of their own and for that reason am very much in favor of all the efforts to cure it and prevent it. If the secondary beneficiaries of that are adults who contract it because of risky behavior that is fine as well.

In the end I disagree that there is a homophobia issue at play here at this point though I believe there once was. I think it has more to do with the fact that most people contract it through risky behavior (or so it is percieved) and a lot of people are pretty indifferent to that.

"Risky behavior" sounds a whole lot like pointing fingers at the homosexual community. That line simply perpetuates the problem. "I am not sympathetic because they did something risky."

That view is one that reflects a very US centric mindset. The AIDS epidemic is, in fact, related to risky behavior, but, sadly, most of those afflicted with AIDS don't have a clue what causes AIDS or how to avoid it. The majority of AIDS casualties won't be in the US, they will be in Africa where over half of all children are born with AIDS in many nations. Should we feel less "sympathetic" towards them? That class overwhelmingly constitutes the group that will die from AIDS, not the class of those who willfully engage in risky behavior understanding the consequences.

[Cali Coug]

Originally Posted by RockyBalboa

Heaven forbid people wear condoms and quit sharing drug needles.

EASILY Preventable behaviors that lead to the MAJORITY of the problem.

Of course this is where liberals take those comments as saying that people who share the sentiment of prevention are saying those who get the disease earned it.

They have an incredible ability to read something and then lie about the what they've just read to convince themselves of factually incorrect thought processes.

This isn't the MAJORITY of the problem as you claim. The MAJORITY of the problem is that people in Africa and other underdeveloped areas don't have a clue what is causing AIDS and millions are dying from it. In those nations, countless victims contract AIDS through rape as well (and then their children contract AIDS through birth). This isn't a "factually incorrect thought process." This is just a fact.

[UtahDan]

Originally Posted by hoyacoug

"Risky behavior" sounds a whole lot like pointing fingers at the homosexual community. That line simply perpetuates the problem. "I am not sympathetic because they did something risky."

That view is one that reflects a very US centric mindset. The AIDS epidemic is, in fact, related to risky behavior, but, sadly, most of those afflicted with AIDS don't have a clue what causes AIDS or how to avoid it. The majority of AIDS casualties won't be in the US, they will be in Africa where over half of all children are born with AIDS in many nations. Should we feel less "sympathetic" towards them? That class overwhelmingly constitutes the group that will die from AIDS, not the class of those who willfully engage in risky behavior understanding the consequences.

I don't know why it sounds like pointing the finger at gays to you. That is not what I am doing. Risky behavior is having unprotected sex of any kind and sharing needles.

I also will not be sold on the idea that people in these countries where AIDS is at epidemic levels, particularly in Africa, are just scratching their heads as to how they caught it. As I understand it, they have been told but won't use condoms for cultural reasons (or just don't want to) and many of them refuse to believe that AIDS is caused by risky behavior. Rather, they blame other things such as (surprise!) the United States.

No, these are not irrational children who refuse to take their medicine. They are rational adults who are making bad choices, albeit in mass. I have sympathy for their children and that is why I support efforts to prevent and find a cure. I maintain, however, that homosexuality just isn't that big an issue here. I don't think many any longer just see it as a "gay" disease and even if they did this disease spreads through risky behavior not by unelightened thought process.

[Cali Coug]

Originally Posted by UtahDan

I don't know why it sounds like pointing the finger at gays to you. That is not what I am doing. Risky behavior is having unprotected sex of any kind and sharing needles.

I also will not be sold on the idea that people in these countries where AIDS is at epidemic levels, particularly in Africa, are just scratching their heads as to how they caught it. As I understand it, they have been told but won't use condoms for cultural reasons (or just don't want to) and many of them refuse to believe that AIDS is caused by risky behavior. Rather, they blame other things such as (surprise!) the United States.

No, these are not irrational children who refuse to take their medicine. They are rational adults who are making bad choices, albeit in mass. I have sympathy for their children and that is why I support efforts to prevent and find a cure. I maintain, however, that homosexuality just isn't that big an issue here. I don't think many any longer just see it as a "gay" disease and even if they did this disease spreads through risky behavior not by unelightened thought process.

I never claimed the disease was spread by "unenlightened thought process." I claimed the cure is hampered by unenlightened thought process. Quite a distinction.

You can't, on the one hand, argue that you don't believe many people are "scratching their heads" as to how they caught AIDS and then, on the other, say that many "refuse to believe it is caused by risky behavior." Both are true in many instances: they scratch their heads because they don't believe what they have heard.

Of course, you are assuming most have heard what causes AIDS, or understood what they have heard, something that is simply not the case. The world is struggling to figure out how to educate individuals in Africa. In many nations, language is a real issue. So are the "cultural issues" you quickly disregard. Those cultural issues often reflect deeply held religious and social beliefs that are not quickly set aside, particulary when the reason for setting them aside is very complicated and, to many, irrational. Below is a link to an interesting article on the topic:

http://www.codesria.org/Links/Public...ds/anugwom.pdf

Go to the area where it talks about perception among Nigerian university students to get an idea of what we are dealing with here.

I do think most who oppose funding AIDS research are homophobes. I have no way of proving this (though I wouldn't be surprised if someone has done a study). In the general population, I think most are viewing it as a threat to everyone and not just homosexuals.

[il Padrino Ute]

Originally Posted by hoyacoug

I never claimed the disease was spread by "unenlightened thought process." I claimed the cure is hampered by unenlightened thought process. Quite a distinction.

You can't, on the one hand, argue that you don't believe many people are "scratching their heads" as to how they caught AIDS and then, on the other, say that many "refuse to believe it is caused by risky behavior." Both are true in many instances: they scratch their heads because they don't believe what they have heard.

Of course, you are assuming most have heard what causes AIDS, or understood what they have heard, something that is simply not the case. The world is struggling to figure out how to educate individuals in Africa. In many nations, language is a real issue. So are the "cultural issues" you quickly disregard. Those cultural issues often reflect deeply held religious and social beliefs that are not quickly set aside, particulary when the reason for setting them aside is very complicated and, to many, irrational. Below is a link to an interesting article on the topic:

http://www.codesria.org/Links/Public...ds/anugwom.pdf

Go to the area where it talks about perception among Nigerian university students to get an idea of what we are dealing with here.

I do think most who oppose funding AIDS research are homophobes. I have no way of proving this (though I wouldn't be surprised if someone has done a study). In the general population, I think most are viewing it as a threat to everyone and not just homosexuals.

More people will still die of heart disease and strokes than of AIDS. Whynot spend more on education and prevention of heart disease and strokes?

I'm against my tax dollars being spent for AIDS treatment because it's a preventable disease. We have other problems in our country where money could be better used - like reducing the deficit.

[Cali Coug]

Originally Posted by il Padrino Ute

More people will still die of heart disease and strokes than of AIDS. Whynot spend more on education and prevention of heart disease and strokes?

I'm against my tax dollars being spent for AIDS treatment because it's a preventable disease. We have other problems in our country where money could be better used - like reducing the deficit.

I don't have a problem with spending on either of those diseases. We should be trying to cure them with whatever resources we can muster as well. The issue I see with AIDS is that many are upset about the funding AIDS gets because they view it as a disease contracted by irresponsible individuals (which is, sadly, often a valid concern). I don't think, however, the answer is to withhold funding from AIDS research, and I think focusing on the small group that contracts AIDS through willfully negligent behavior harms the overall search for a cure to AIDS.

[MikeWaters]

One of the problems with AIDS is that it causes poverty and instability in those countries where the prevalence is high. Ultimately this may lead to war and terrorism. So we have incentives to prevent this kind of ongoing disaster.

And as a Christian, what right do you have to harden your hearts? I guess it depends on what kind of Christian you are.

A separate issue is how we treat the disease in the United States. We treat it like a big secret, instead of a deadly communicative disease. For other STD's and serious infectious diseases there are laws related to reporting it and warning others that might have contacted the disease from the affected person. In other words, privacy has been favored over stamping out the disease. Privacy has also lead to stigmatization. "HIV victims should be treated like any other person with disease, but we tackle it in an ineffective way, different from any other similar disease." This has multiplied the devastation of this disease.