Europe and Japan: You're on your own America

[8ballrollin]

Bah. Come on, SU. Did you even read the end of the piece? Japan and Germany aren't taking any action because 1) They've already pumped billions into their banks over the summer and 2) they can't do anything.

Once again the Anglo-American allies have to clean up after the party that everyone attended but no one stayed around to put away the chairs.

Even if we're wrong (the Fed and Treasury) you don't want to be seen rooting for the EU, sorry.

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by All-American

Yeah, if only church leaders would have given instructions along the lines of avoiding debt and living within our means. Their silence is deafening.

that's not the same thing as avoiding materialism. But then again, when they almost all have second homes, what exactly is it that they are going to say?

[All-American]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

that's not the same thing as avoiding materialism. But then again, when they almost all have second homes, what exactly is it that they are going to say?

How big's your house, Mike? How many cars do you have? What's your annual income? What percentile of wealth does this place you in for the nation? Your state? Your city? Your ward?

There's a reason ad hominem arguments are the first to be thrown out. They're just too easy.

So I won't even ask you to refer me to the sources by which you ascertained that almost all General Authorities have second homes-- though I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that it doesn't exist-- since the argument which your made-up evidence bolsters is irrelevant to the point at hand anyway.

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by All-American

How big's your house, Mike? How many cars do you have? What's your annual income? What percentile of wealth does this place you in for the nation? Your state? Your city? Your ward?

There's a reason ad hominem arguments are the first to be thrown out. They're just too easy.

So I won't even ask you to refer me to the sources by which you ascertained that almost all General Authorities have second homes-- though I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that it doesn't exist-- since the argument which your made-up evidence bolsters is irrelevant to the point at hand anyway.

my house looks to be much smaller than these houses.

http://www.salamandersociety.com/foyer/gamap/

I can only guess as to why they don't speak out very much against materialism. Getting into debt and materialism are different, though often related, things.

[All-American]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

my house looks to be much smaller than these houses.

http://www.salamandersociety.com/foyer/gamap/

I can only guess as to why they don't speak out very much against materialism. Getting into debt and materialism are different, though often related, things.

First, I notice that about half of the twelve have second homes. I also notice that some of those pictures are of former homes. Either way, not "almost all."

Second, some of them have owned those homes for several decades, well before they became real estate gems, and often before they became general authorities.

Third, this line of argument, along with this website, is despicable.

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by All-American

First, I notice that about half of the twelve have second homes. I also notice that some of those pictures are of former homes. Either way, not "almost all."

Second, some of them have owned those homes for several decades, well before they became real estate gems, and often before they became general authorities.

Third, this line of argument, along with this website, is despicable.

are the homes million dollar homes? I have no idea. You make it sound like they are worth well beyond anything that avg. American has.

Personally, I think materialism is a greater spiritual threat than civil unions and gay marriages. But I am a no one, and my opinion matters for little. And if I say anything, it is "despicable."

Materialism is a very small topic in today's church. It is a dominating theme in the BoM. Either I am deaf, or I have exquisite hearing. I'm not sure which.

[il Padrino Ute]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

my house looks to be much smaller than these houses.

http://www.salamandersociety.com/foyer/gamap/

I can only guess as to why they don't speak out very much against materialism. Getting into debt and materialism are different, though often related, things.

Did you really link to an anti site to back up your claim?

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by il Padrino Ute

Did you really link to an anti site to back up your claim?

I don't know what kind of site it is, nor if those descriptions are accurate.

I had heard that it was common for the apostles to have second homes in Utah. I can't remember the source.

I mean, is this a shock to anyone if it is true?

This is a church where it is a running joke that if you are wealthy you will eventually be a bishop or a stake president. That tells you something.

[ute4ever]

Ann Eliza Young has a horrific tale of marriage to Brigham Young and living in his mansion. Don't the brethren realize that Lehi dwelt in a mere tent?

[All-American]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

are the homes million dollar homes? I have no idea. You make it sound like they are worth well beyond anything that avg. American has.

Personally, I think materialism is a greater spiritual threat than civil unions and gay marriages. But I am a no one, and my opinion matters for little. And if I say anything, it is "despicable."

Materialism is a very small topic in today's church. It is a dominating theme in the BoM. Either I am deaf, or I have exquisite hearing. I'm not sure which.

Give me some credit. The only thing I have categorized as despicable are your attempts to bring in the personal lives of the leaders of the church as discussion fodder. You should know better than that.

There are better ways to argue that materialism is a problem, a premise with which I happen to agree. Don't go dragging them through the mud to do it.