Okinawans protest revisions to World War II history

[Jeff Lebowski]

Originally Posted by nikuman

I've read of him. Much of the information about the massacre we have comes from his records, as I recall.

For those of you who don't know much about it, wikipedia has an article that's fairly lengthy. Even reading that makes me sick, though.

Not long after I read Chang's book, I visited the Hiroshima Peace Park. They had a small blurb in the museum about the rape of Nanking. And it was 90% bullshit. Boy did that make me angry.

[creekster]

Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski

Not long after I read Chang's book, I visited the Hiroshima Peace Park. They had a small blurb in the museum about the rape of Nanking. And it was 90% bullshit. Boy did that make me angry.

As you may know, Chang committed suicide. Her family has speculated in the press that the depressive effect of her work on the book was a significant cause of her decision to do so.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Originally Posted by creekster

As you may know, Chang committed suicide. Her family has speculated in the press that the depressive effect of her work on the book was a significant cause of her decision to do so.

Oh my. I didn't know that.

[nikuman]

Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski

Not long after I read Chang's book, I visited the Hiroshima Peace Park. They had a small blurb in the museum about the rape of Nanking. And it was 90% bullshit. Boy did that make me angry.

I've never been there, but would like to go. I really think that the Japanese people as a whole were victimized as well, although obviously not to the extent of the Chinese. One day when I have more time I'll give my complete opinion on why I think the war started and the dangers of a decentralized military structure.

When looked at in a vacuum, I'm personally of the opinion that the A-bombs were not only necessary but benevolent, in a strange way. If you don't scare Japan into surrendering, you're looking at a loss of maybe 500,000 more Americans or more, and several million Japanese - and even the A-bombs were nearly not enough, if you didn't have Hirohito going behind the ruling military's back. The undernourished Japanese citizens were being trained to fight us off at the beach with bamboo spears. People also forget that more people died in one night of firebombing in Tokyo than died in both A-bombs combined.

Originally Posted by creekster

As you may know, Chang committed suicide. Her family has speculated in the press that the depressive effect of her work on the book was a significant cause of her decision to do so.

It was only a couple of years ago, as I recall. I cannot dispute her family's opinion on this point; I would rather see pictures of holocaust victims than read about the Rape of Nanking. And that's coming from a guy who had a grandfather in a concentration camp and has heard a lot of crazy stories.

[JohnnyLingo]

Wow... after reading up on this, I can only ask, "Why?"

Why the brutality? Why the complete disregard for human life and decency?

[Archaea]

Originally Posted by JohnnyLingo

Wow... after reading up on this, I can only ask, "Why?"

Why the brutality? Why the complete disregard for human life and decency?

It is one of the worst if not the worst recorded chapters of inhumanity ever. We should not forget it and Japan should not be allowed to forget it. It is worse than the concentration camps. okay maybe an overstatement, grossly overstated, but it was horrible, something we little remember.

[RockyBalboa]

I'd be interested in some links that those who've read about the Rape of Nanking.

WWII is a subject that interests me greatly, but am embarrassed to admit my knowledge on this particular part is sorely lacking.


Ugh...I just typed in "The Rape of Nanking" on Wikipedia and started reading and I'm sickened.

Seriously, I'm physically sick from reading that.

I'd known about and read of the atrocities the Japanese committed during and after the Bataan Death March, but I hadn't known much about Nanking.

Truly appalling in every sense of the word.

[nikuman]

Originally Posted by Archaea

It is one of the worst if not the worst recorded chapters of inhumanity ever. We should not forget it and Japan should not be allowed to forget it. It is worse than the concentration camps. okay maybe an overstatement, grossly overstated, but it was horrible, something we little remember.

I'm not sure it's an overstatement. Perhaps in terms of duration, but certainly not in depravity.

Or, as I remarked to a friend a little while ago, it seems to me, disgusting as this sounds, that the marginal value of a human life when dealing with massacres is such that the jump from the murder of one million to two million is not viewed as abhorrently as the jump from 500,000 to one million. For right or wrong.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Originally Posted by RockyBalboa

I'd be interested in some links that those who've read about the Rape of Nanking.

WWII is a subject that interests me greatly, but am embarrassed to admit my knowledge on this particular part is sorely lacking.

This is the book we are talking about:

http://www.amazon.com/Rape-Nanking-F...2058229&sr=8-2

It is the definitive work on this event. It is a relatively short book and is well-written and researched. But it is deeply disturbing.

Basically, the Japanese were absolutely brutal when they occupied China. Nanking was the capital of China at the time and the Japanese won a series of hard-fought battle culminating in the conquest of Nanking. They then went a prolonged (several weeks) orgy of raping and killing the civilians in Nanking. IIRC, Chang estimates about 300,000 were butchered. The Japanese government has always insisted that not much happened, but the evidence and documentation are overwhelming.

[Jeff Lebowski]

One more thing: The Rape of Nanking is important to understand not just because it is a major historical event of WWII, but because it has a bearing our current world politics. While the details of this event may not be well-known or understood in the west, you can rest assured that all Chinese and Koreans know about it and most still hate the Japanese for it. It is a strong undercurrent to Asian politics.