06-23-2006, 04:20 PM | #41 |
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this is why some find it frustrating that the current prophets and apostles say nothing on the subject.
good thing that we have message boards so people can actually talk about it. has anyone ever attended a church meeting in which this subject was tackled in a substantive way? |
06-23-2006, 04:31 PM | #42 | |||
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Of course we don't need answers for everything, but if the church is lead by Jesus, why the inconsistency? The Lord isn't a lord of confusion, he is a Lord of absolution and love. Dispensational changes are understandable but as you put it, doctrinal changes where the power of God is distributed drastically different over a 125 year span? Seems weird the Lord would change his mind so drastically so quickly. Quote:
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I uphold and follow the prophet, I think he gives us directives that are extremely valuable and we need to, in part, follow those to maintain certain relationships with our Heavenly Father and Savior.....BUT.....if everything the prophet says is doctrine and the will of the Lord, you are setting up the church to be a highly changing, fallible, and inconsistent organization. Absolutely different than the canon presented and accepted as the will of the Lord. In fact, I don't know how somebody can maintain faithful in the church if he doesn't take many quotes of the prophets as mistakes of men. The church to me, rings highly untrue, if everything said by prophets was doctrine, or the will of the Lord as you so matter of factly put it. |
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06-23-2006, 04:43 PM | #43 | |||||
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06-23-2006, 04:53 PM | #44 |
I must not tell lies
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Have you ever seen a ward get a new bishop, or a mission get a new president, and he changes the way a few things are done? Those are mere policy changes, based upon the wisdom of an individual. Nothing doctrinal.
I can only assume that the men who succeeded Joseph Smith thought his associations with blacks and the priesthood were not doctrinal, but mere personal preferences that they did not agree with. However, I was not there. I did not witness their conversations. Maybe Joseph told Brigham et al that he was uncetain if what he was doing was right, and thought it safe to error on the side of inclusion. Maybe the Lord was silent in the matter. Although he was prophet of the dispensation, I doubt the Lord held his hand in all things. In fact, Joseph's documented frustration with the length of time he spent in prison under a silent Lord shows that often he was left to his own devices. And because I was not there, I cannot say who was speaking under direction of the Lord and who was not; or what was done under conscience of Joseph's upbringing or how Brigham was raised to view the same. |
06-23-2006, 04:56 PM | #45 | |
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It's so interesting how people like fusnik seek to twist the past of the church to fit their current PC views. Fussy, if you're still in the church ten years from now, I will be very surprised. |
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06-23-2006, 05:02 PM | #46 | |
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Interesting, your line of thinking.... Last question..... Do you believe that the moon was inhabited by men who dressed like quakers? Do you believe that no man will ever walk on the moon? Do you believe dinosaurs essentially didn't exist? All things prophets have said, ie, in your words, the will of the Lord, ie, the Lord said those things, not men. |
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06-23-2006, 05:07 PM | #47 | |
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Facts: a. Joseph gave blacks the priesthood b. The church called blacks to missions c. Joseph was anti-slavery d. Joseph allowed a black man to be a close confidant and lauded his person e. Brigham said blacks were the seed of Cain f. Harold B. Lee said blacks would never hold the priesthood g. Joseph Fielding Smith said blacks were less faithful in the pre-earth life So tell me the mental gymastics you are doing to fit that all into the will of the Lord? Amazing how in 1840 the Lord was loving his black man but in 1950 the Lord was worried about black people giving blood in Utah because the cursed blood would be entering into the annointed of the Lord. |
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06-23-2006, 05:07 PM | #48 | |
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I would encourage you to read your scriptures, pray, and gain a testimony. And here's a fusism for you, "You just don't agree because you don't know as much as me." |
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06-23-2006, 05:17 PM | #49 |
I must not tell lies
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It's so interesting how people like the ninja so frequently add contention and personal attacks when discussing religious matters, or discussing just about anything. Who is the source of contention? Who is the ninja trying to emulate? Who does the ninja honor with his behavior? Does the ninja spend three hours a week physically present in a church building, so his wife and the community will see he is a good person; while his words and actions during the other 165 hours of the week reflect his true character? Ninja, if you're still in the church ten years from now, I will be very surprised.
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06-23-2006, 05:18 PM | #50 | |
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