Road to Apostasy/Inactivity?

[creekster]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

It's clear to me that the biggest factor in your continued activity is your low level of intelligence, impoverished education, and general inability to think for yourself, which is inbred and maybe the most despicable form of sloth. You're a dolt. Everything you write bespeaks this about you.

Calm down, buddy. That doesn't even make sense. If it is an inbred inabilty how can it be sloth? Mellow out a little bit, eh?

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by cougarobgon

SU your quote above were not comments directed at me, but, I assume that you believe that not only SMR, but also many of us that remain active in the Church have a low level of intelligence, an impoverished education, and generally cannot think for ourselves, and are sloths. While I am far from being considered an intellectual, my education is limited to an MBA, that I completed while working two jobs, raising a family with 5 kids at the time, and during the last year of school, served as bishop of my ward. While an MBA is not a degree in philosophy or medicine, I don't believe that it constitutes an impoverished education and just based on what little background I have given you about myself, it would be difficult for you to label me a sloth. The commitment I made to my religion came very early in my youth and although over the last 30 years doubts, questions, and weaknessess have surfaced in my self, I cannot deny that experience I had with the "Spirit" that you may attribute to my lack of intelligence or education.

What I believe to be true has come about over many years of self analysis, thought, meditation, and prayer. I may no be able to hold your "jock strap" in a conversation about the philosophies of men, but, I believe that I can hold my own defending my beliefs. It is just fascinating to me how two individuals can be taught the same things about religion and the philosophies of men, yet reach totally different conclusions. That makes life quite enjoyable.

If you carefully read my posts here you will see that in the aggregate I'm quite charitable toward and intensely interested in religions, religious history, and even religious experience. I have gone so far as to say that religious history and world history are the nearly same thing until the Seventheenth Century, when they start to diverge. I think that's clearly true. Even the Enlightenment is only fully understood as a contrast to religion, as its proponensts saw it. I am nearly as critical of the dogmatic atheists as dogmatic religious people. On the other hand, one facet I find intolerable about Mormonism is its cavalier dismissal of religious history and experience outside Mormonism, and Mormons' debt to it in just about every way you can think of.

My post that you quote wasn't all that serious and was in fact kind of a parody. But I honestly do believe that Mormons who go through life in the self-satisfied delusion that anyone who rejects their way of life must be lazy and/or immoral are just flat out stupid. They lack the capacity to think critically, are out of touch with the world, and in fact with themselves. I was directing my post to the demonstrably ignorant SMR, not you. I appreciate you sharing your nuanced perspective.

Take this for what it's worth, but for my part, I'm satisfied I live a hard working disciplined life, very nearly a life of drudgery, actualy. I work almost to a fault, and spend every spare moment reading or in exchanges like this. But I'd nearly rather have bamboo shoots thrust up inside my nails as sit through an LDS sacrament meeting. The banality and nonsense is pure torture. That's just the way I am; I'm not looking for license to "sin." I promise. I think it's a total waste of time and harmful to my children, especially my daughters.

[creekster]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

But I'd nearly rather have bamboo shoots thrust up inside my nails as sit through an LDS sacrament meeting. The banality and nonsense is pure torture. That's just the way I am; I'm not looking for license to "sin." I promise. I think it's a total waste of time and harmful to my children, especially my daughters.

Thnaks. That's much better.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

On the other hand, one facet I find intolerable about Mormonism is its cavalier dismissal of religious history and experience outside Mormonism, and Mormons' debt to it in just about every way you can think of.

...

Wycliffe was denounced as a heretic and treated accordingly. After he died and was buried, his bones were dug up and burned. But God’s work could not be stopped. ...

Tyndale, enlightened by the Spirit of God ...

We express gratitude to all who lived in England and throughout Europe who helped kindle that light.

- Elder Robert D. Hales, Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, Oct 2005 Conference

We owe much to the many brave martyrs and reformers like Martin Luther, John Calvin, and John Huss who demanded freedom to worship and common access to the holy books...

Because of the efforts of the reformers, “the Bible became a household possession. The word of God was read around the family fireside of the lowly as well as the parlors of the great” (John A. Widtsoe, in Conference Report, Apr. 1939, 20).

- Elder M. Russell Ballard, Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, April 2007 Conference

In due time honest men with yearning hearts, at the peril of their very lives, attempted to establish points of reference, that they might find the true way. The day of the Reformation was dawning, but the path ahead was difficult. Persecutions would be severe, personal sacrifice overwhelming, and the cost beyond calculation. The reformers were pioneers, blazing wilderness trails in a desperate search for those lost points of reference which, they felt, when found would lead mankind back to the truth Jesus taught.

John Wycliffe, Martin Luther, Jan Hus, Zwingli, Knox, Calvin, and Tyndale all pioneered the period of the Reformation. Significant was the declaration of Tyndale to his critics: “I will cause a boy that driveth the plough shall know more of the scripture than thou doest.”

Such were the teachings and lives of the great reformers. Their deeds were heroic, their contributions many, their sacrifices great ...

- Thomas S. Monson, First Presidency, April 1997 Conference

I could go on, but you can Google as easily as I ...

[TripletDaddy]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

If you carefully read my posts here you will see that in the aggregate I'm quite charitable toward and intensely interested in religions, religious history, and even religious experience. I have gone so far as to say that religious history and world history are the nearly same thing until the Seventheenth Century, when they start to diverge. I think that's clearly true. Even the Enlightenment is only fully understood as a contrast to religion, as its proponensts saw it. I am nearly as critical of the dogmatic atheists as dogmatic religious people. On the other hand, one facet I find intolerable about Mormonism is its cavalier dismissal of religious history and experience outside Mormonism, and Mormons' debt to it in just about every way you can think of.

My post that you quote wasn't all that serious and was in fact kind of a parody. But I honestly do believe that Mormons who go through life in the self-satisfied delusion that anyone who rejects their way of life must be lazy and/or immoral are just flat out stupid. They lack the capacity to think critically, are out of touch with the world, and in fact with themselves. I was directing my post to the demonstrably ignorant SMR, not you. I appreciate you sharing your nuanced perspective.

Take this for what it's worth, but for my part, I'm satisfied I live a hard working disciplined life, very nearly a life of drudgery, actualy. I work almost to a fault, and spend every spare moment reading or in exchanges like this. But I'd nearly rather have bamboo shoots thrust up inside my nails as sit through an LDS sacrament meeting. The banality and nonsense is pure torture. That's just the way I am; I'm not looking for license to "sin." I promise. I think it's a total waste of time and harmful to my children, especially my daughters.

What the heck is wrong with you today? Why the animosity towards SMR? Esp from one who laments his own public school education.

I am never personally threatened by your rants against mormonism, but you have been somewhat surly today towards individual posters, and truthfully none of it has been merited.

Settle down, you have the nicest legs here. No one is taking that title away.

[CardiacCoug]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

But I'd nearly rather have bamboo shoots thrust up inside my nails as sit through an LDS sacrament meeting. The banality and nonsense is pure torture. That's just the way I am; I'm not looking for license to "sin." I promise. I think it's a total waste of time and harmful to my children, especially my daughters.

I think sacrament meeting is worse in your memory than in reality. I agree that the talks can be boring, but listening to even the worst talk provides interesting sociological insights. Actually it's some of the terrible talks that can give you the most insight into how certain people (with whom I would never interact otherwise outside of Church) think about life and religion.

I enjoy singing the hymns with my kids and drawing pictures with my kids during the boring talks, too. It's not that bad. I sit through medical conference talks all the time that are as boring as the average sacrament meeting talk.

[Black Diamond Bay]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

If you carefully read my posts here you will see that in the aggregate I'm quite charitable toward and intensely interested in religions, religious history, and even religious experience. I have gone so far as to say that religious history and world history are the nearly same thing until the Seventheenth Century, when they start to diverge. I think that's clearly true. Even the Enlightenment is only fully understood as a contrast to religion, as its proponensts saw it. I am nearly as critical of the dogmatic atheists as dogmatic religious people. On the other hand, one facet I find intolerable about Mormonism is its cavalier dismissal of religious history and experience outside Mormonism, and Mormons' debt to it in just about every way you can think of.

My post that you quote wasn't all that serious and was in fact kind of a parody. But I honestly do believe that Mormons who go through life in the self-satisfied delusion that anyone who rejects their way of life must be lazy and/or immoral are just flat out stupid. They lack the capacity to think critically, are out of touch with the world, and in fact with themselves. I was directing my post to the demonstrably ignorant SMR, not you. I appreciate you sharing your nuanced perspective.

Take this for what it's worth, but for my part, I'm satisfied I live a hard working disciplined life, very nearly a life of drudgery, actualy. I work almost to a fault, and spend every spare moment reading or in exchanges like this. But I'd nearly rather have bamboo shoots thrust up inside my nails as sit through an LDS sacrament meeting. The banality and nonsense is pure torture. That's just the way I am; I'm not looking for license to "sin." I promise. I think it's a total waste of time and harmful to my children, especially my daughters.

SU is "quite charitable?" That's not exactly the first word that springs to mind, but whatever...

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by Black Diamond Bay

SU is "quite charitable?" That's not exactly the first word that springs to mind, but whatever...

Signed, she who says apostates are possessed by demons

[YOhio]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

Signed, she who says apostates are possessed by demons

Don't
Enjoy
Meetings
O
N
Sunday

She is correct.

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by TripletDaddy

What the heck is wrong with you today? Why the animosity towards SMR? Esp from one who laments his own public school education.

I am never personally threatened by your rants against mormonism, but you have been somewhat surly today towards individual posters, and truthfully none of it has been merited.

Settle down, you have the nicest legs here. No one is taking that title away.

End of month. I'm working on bills. I'd rather be attending an LDS SM than do that.

Did you see the things SM, Arch, and Il Pad have called me?