Stem Cells, Religious Wackos, Seeing the Light - cougarguard.com — unofficial BYU Cougars / LDS sports, football, basketball forum and message board

Ceteris Paribus · 10-27-2008, 05:01 PM

Although this post may "out" me to some here, cannot restrain wrath.

Just received phone call from wife after returning from Dr. appointment. Son, 8 years old, diagnosed at 4 with Type I Diabetes, now up to 6 injections daily. During the appointment, wife broke down in frustration at the insidious and progressive nature of the disease.

Physician took the time to express frustration with the Bush/Religious Right position on stem cell research. She said we have literally lost 8 years of precious research time on the absolute best hope to find a cure - not only for diabetes, but a milieu of other life threatening conditions. All because "W" and his buddies are supposedly protecting the sanctity of life.

How can these religious nutjobs deny hope based on their faulty premise that frozen embryos that are going to be destroyed represent human life and should not be used to help others? Cannot and will not ever believe in the same God as these evil people.

Physician went on to say there is optimism in the medical community that the Obama administration will loosen the absurd restraints and fund stem cell research. McCain is soft on this issue and Palin left her brain in Nome.

Not too proud to admit errors - hereby renouncing previous posts supporting McCain. Sorry for the absurdity of this position.

So, the same folks who deny the existence/benefits of modern science, claim the earth is 6,000 years old, and wear their pious beliefs in a wrathful God on their shirtsleeves can rot in hell.

Jeff Lebowski · 10-27-2008, 06:33 PM

Sorry to hear that, CP. Best of luck as you deal with this. Dealing with an ill child can be heartbreaking.

ERCougar · 10-27-2008, 06:48 PM

I totally disagree with the stem-cell ban, but I think the doctor is way out-of-line to use the initial diagnosis of diabetes as a time to discuss politics. If she wants to discuss it later on, after the emotional adjustment of a life-changing disease has taken place, then fine. But these first few months should be entirely focused on how you and your family are going to deal with this, not on what an a-hole Bush is.

We're a long ways off (more than 8 years) of replacing beta cells in the pancreas. Even the most optimistic researcher realizes this.

Tex · 10-27-2008, 06:52 PM

It seems to me physicians do their patients a great disservice by injecting politics into their treatment. Those who do inflict their patients with both false hope and a false scapegoat. Reminds me of Edwards' 2004 promise that a Kerry administration would heal quadriplegics.

The potential benefits of stem cell research are still very hypothetical and may or may not be realized. The moral questions are very real and ought to deliberated carefully. And, the topic has become a proxy for the abortion debate, with all the emotion that carries.

People with difficult illnesses and their families are caught in the crossfire. What a shame.

SoCalCoug · 10-28-2008, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex

The potential benefits of stem cell research are still very hypothetical and may or may not be realized.

Isn't any scientific research "hypothetical"? That's the whole point of the scientific method: you come up with a hypothesis, and then you test it. To criticize scientific research because it's "hypothetical" is missing the point a bit, I think.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex

The moral questions are very real and ought to deliberated carefully. And, the topic has become a proxy for the abortion debate, with all the emotion that carries.

Is it your moral belief that it is better to discard the unused embryos than to use them for stem cell research? In vitro fertilization results in unused embryos, which are often discarded. If not discarded, they sit in a freezer indefinitely. Is it therefore immoral to engage in in vitro fertilization?

Tex · 10-28-2008, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoCalCoug

Isn't any scientific research "hypothetical"? That's the whole point of the scientific method: you come up with a hypothesis, and then you test it. To criticize scientific research because it's "hypothetical" is missing the point a bit, I think.

Is it your moral belief that it is better to discard the unused embryos than to use them for stem cell research? In vitro fertilization results in unused embryos, which are often discarded. If not discarded, they sit in a freezer indefinitely. Is it therefore immoral to engage in in vitro fertilization?

I don't really want to open a new debate on stem cell research. I simply think this doctor misbehaved by inserting her personal politics into her patient's treatment, causing them unnecessary grief and pain. Do you disagree?

SoCalCoug · 10-28-2008, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex

I don't really want to open a new debate on stem cell research. I simply think this doctor misbehaved by inserting her personal politics into her patient's treatment, causing them unnecessary grief and pain. Do you disagree?

You get my answer when I get yours. I asked first.

Tex · 10-28-2008, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoCalCoug

You get my answer when I get yours. I asked first.

*shrug* Okay.

SoCalCoug · 10-28-2008, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex

*shrug* Okay.

You're uncomfortable with 2-way communication in a debate? Your way is not a debate. It's a lecture. Or sermon.

Tex · 10-28-2008, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoCalCoug

You're uncomfortable with 2-way communication in a debate?

Just not interested in discussing stem cells today. Go goad someone else.

10-27-2008, 05:01 PM	#1
Ceteris Paribus Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 63	Stem Cells, Religious Wackos, Seeing the Light Although this post may "out" me to some here, cannot restrain wrath. Just received phone call from wife after returning from Dr. appointment. Son, 8 years old, diagnosed at 4 with Type I Diabetes, now up to 6 injections daily. During the appointment, wife broke down in frustration at the insidious and progressive nature of the disease. Physician took the time to express frustration with the Bush/Religious Right position on stem cell research. She said we have literally lost 8 years of precious research time on the absolute best hope to find a cure - not only for diabetes, but a milieu of other life threatening conditions. All because "W" and his buddies are supposedly protecting the sanctity of life. How can these religious nutjobs deny hope based on their faulty premise that frozen embryos that are going to be destroyed represent human life and should not be used to help others? Cannot and will not ever believe in the same God as these evil people. Physician went on to say there is optimism in the medical community that the Obama administration will loosen the absurd restraints and fund stem cell research. McCain is soft on this issue and Palin left her brain in Nome. Not too proud to admit errors - hereby renouncing previous posts supporting McCain. Sorry for the absurdity of this position. So, the same folks who deny the existence/benefits of modern science, claim the earth is 6,000 years old, and wear their pious beliefs in a wrathful God on their shirtsleeves can rot in hell.

10-27-2008, 06:33 PM	#2
Jeff Lebowski Charon Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: In the heart of darkness (Provo) Posts: 9,564	Sorry to hear that, CP. Best of luck as you deal with this. Dealing with an ill child can be heartbreaking. __________________ "... the arc of the universe is long but it bends toward justice." Martin Luther King, Jr.

10-27-2008, 06:52 PM	#4
Tex Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 8,596	It seems to me physicians do their patients a great disservice by injecting politics into their treatment. Those who do inflict their patients with both false hope and a false scapegoat. Reminds me of Edwards' 2004 promise that a Kerry administration would heal quadriplegics. The potential benefits of stem cell research are still very hypothetical and may or may not be realized. The moral questions are very real and ought to deliberated carefully. And, the topic has become a proxy for the abortion debate, with all the emotion that carries. People with difficult illnesses and their families are caught in the crossfire. What a shame. __________________ "Have we been commanded not to call a prophet an insular racist? Link?" "And yes, [2010] is a very good year to be a Democrat. Perhaps the best year in decades ..." - Cali Coug "Oh dear, granny, what a long tail our puss has got." - Brigham Young

10-27-2008, 06:48 PM	#3
ERCougar Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,589	I totally disagree with the stem-cell ban, but I think the doctor is way out-of-line to use the initial diagnosis of diabetes as a time to discuss politics. If she wants to discuss it later on, after the emotional adjustment of a life-changing disease has taken place, then fine. But these first few months should be entirely focused on how you and your family are going to deal with this, not on what an a-hole Bush is. We're a long ways off (more than 8 years) of replacing beta cells in the pancreas. Even the most optimistic researcher realizes this.