How much education does a SAHM need? - cougarguard.com — unofficial BYU Cougars / LDS sports, football, basketball forum and message board

BarbaraGordon · 05-15-2009, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex

Right.

http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/152604

Tex · 05-15-2009, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BarbaraGordon

http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/152604

This is really unnecessary, Barbara, and I'm disappointed you want to go there. You've really joined the snark crowd the last couple of weeks.

Tex · 05-15-2009, 06:06 PM

I decided I have a little more to say on this (not on SAHM, but on Barbara's contribution).

I try to walk softly when it comes to other people's religions. I grew up in Texas as a minority faith around a lot of diversity in belief. Funny enough, I took very little crap for my own. My Christian friends were typically quite concilliatory, and their acceptance helped me to respect our differences as well as our similarities. I've tried to emulate that everywhere I've gone since.

It's no secret I have fierce words when it comes to "my own": Mormons that I don't think toe the line. But I think you'd be hard pressed to find any of my posts that speak ill of other faiths.

As best as I can remember, Barbara used to follow that paradigm too. I don't recall her getting her hands dirty in some of our huge LDS policy/doctrine arguments. For some reason (maybe because she considered BYU?) that's changed recently, particularly when it comes to the role of women in the church. Apparently spending some time on a sports message board and a pamphlet from the BYU law school suddenly have emboldened her to think she knows what she's talking about. It doesn't help that self-loathers like Waters fan the fire.

It's demeaning. It's really unfortunate. It doesn't help inter-faith discourse.

MikeWaters · 05-15-2009, 06:10 PM

Tex, what role?

Cali Coug · 05-15-2009, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex

I decided I have a little more to say on this (not on SAHM, but on Barbara's contribution).

I try to walk softly when it comes to other people's religions. I grew up in Texas as a minority faith around a lot of diversity in belief. Funny enough, I took very little crap for my own. My Christian friends were typically quite concilliatory, and their acceptance helped me to respect our differences as well as our similarities. I've tried to emulate that everywhere I've gone since.

It's no secret I have fierce words when it comes to "my own": Mormons that I don't think toe the line. But I think you'd be hard pressed to find any of my posts that speak ill of other faiths.

As best as I can remember, Barbara used to follow that paradigm too. I don't recall her getting her hands dirty in some of our huge LDS policy/doctrine arguments. For some reason (maybe because she considered BYU?) that's changed recently, particularly when it comes to the role of women in the church. Apparently spending some time on a sports message board and a pamphlet from the BYU law school suddenly have emboldened her to think she knows what she's talking about. It doesn't help that self-loathers like Waters fan the fire.

It's demeaning. It's really unfortunate. It doesn't help inter-faith discourse.

This doesn't make sense. Are you suggesting only Mormons can properly discuss whether or not the church and/or BYU incentivize women to either not get an education or, alternatively, not use the education they obtained in the workplace?

MikeWaters · 05-15-2009, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cali Coug

This doesn't make sense. Are you suggesting only Mormons can properly discuss whether or not the church and/or BYU incentivize women to either not get an education or, alternatively, not use the education they obtained in the workplace?

I don't think that is what Tex said at all. He said no one can discuss it.

BarbaraGordon · 05-15-2009, 06:19 PM

You know, Tex, you can think of me whatever you wish.

I don't think you can find a single instance in which I have honestly criticized the church (although I did at one point suggest that the doctrinal focus on works can lead to frustration and a sense of inadequacy).

I do think the BYU law school mailing was awfully odd. Even the LDS women I talked to were taken aback (and one was inspired to a very rare fit of profanity) at the material.

In this thread I was sincere in what I wrote to A-A. Are all thirty-year-old Mormon women unhappy? No. Are most? Probably not. But my experience in talking to them is that there's considerable pressure to pursue a certain life course. I believe that that was Mike's point, and I was agreeing with him.

I don't know if you read CUF. If you do, then perhaps you're referring to my trolling of UtahDan two weeks ago. I'm surprised you would fall for that. In general, the use of phrases like "archaic misogyny" and "pathetic holdover from a bygone era" is a pretty good indication that a poster is not engaging in genuine, earnest discussion.

I think my feelings on the church and its members are a well-established matter of record. Do I think there are inherent dangers in the messages that cultures like yours and mine send to young women? Absolutely. But after all I've posted in three years, if you wish to think that I honestly believe that the church is a misogynist mechanism for the institutionalized repression of women, well, nothing I say now is going to change your mind.

Mormon Red Death · 05-18-2009, 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex

This is really unnecessary, Barbara, and I'm disappointed you want to go there. You've really joined the snark crowd the last couple of weeks.

please.. her suggestion for byu marketing was hilarious.

05-15-2009, 06:06 PM	#3
Tex Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 8,596	I decided I have a little more to say on this (not on SAHM, but on Barbara's contribution). I try to walk softly when it comes to other people's religions. I grew up in Texas as a minority faith around a lot of diversity in belief. Funny enough, I took very little crap for my own. My Christian friends were typically quite concilliatory, and their acceptance helped me to respect our differences as well as our similarities. I've tried to emulate that everywhere I've gone since. It's no secret I have fierce words when it comes to "my own": Mormons that I don't think toe the line. But I think you'd be hard pressed to find any of my posts that speak ill of other faiths. As best as I can remember, Barbara used to follow that paradigm too. I don't recall her getting her hands dirty in some of our huge LDS policy/doctrine arguments. For some reason (maybe because she considered BYU?) that's changed recently, particularly when it comes to the role of women in the church. Apparently spending some time on a sports message board and a pamphlet from the BYU law school suddenly have emboldened her to think she knows what she's talking about. It doesn't help that self-loathers like Waters fan the fire. It's demeaning. It's really unfortunate. It doesn't help inter-faith discourse. __________________ "Have we been commanded not to call a prophet an insular racist? Link?" "And yes, [2010] is a very good year to be a Democrat. Perhaps the best year in decades ..." - Cali Coug "Oh dear, granny, what a long tail our puss has got." - Brigham Young

05-15-2009, 06:10 PM	#4
MikeWaters Demiurge Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 36,365	Tex, what role?

05-15-2009, 06:19 PM	#7
BarbaraGordon Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Gotham City Posts: 7,157	You know, Tex, you can think of me whatever you wish. I don't think you can find a single instance in which I have honestly criticized the church (although I did at one point suggest that the doctrinal focus on works can lead to frustration and a sense of inadequacy). I do think the BYU law school mailing was awfully odd. Even the LDS women I talked to were taken aback (and one was inspired to a very rare fit of profanity) at the material. In this thread I was sincere in what I wrote to A-A. Are all thirty-year-old Mormon women unhappy? No. Are most? Probably not. But my experience in talking to them is that there's considerable pressure to pursue a certain life course. I believe that that was Mike's point, and I was agreeing with him. I don't know if you read CUF. If you do, then perhaps you're referring to my trolling of UtahDan two weeks ago. I'm surprised you would fall for that. In general, the use of phrases like "archaic misogyny" and "pathetic holdover from a bygone era" is a pretty good indication that a poster is not engaging in genuine, earnest discussion. I think my feelings on the church and its members are a well-established matter of record. Do I think there are inherent dangers in the messages that cultures like yours and mine send to young women? Absolutely. But after all I've posted in three years, if you wish to think that I honestly believe that the church is a misogynist mechanism for the institutionalized repression of women, well, nothing I say now is going to change your mind.