Luke 2:8

[Archaea]

2:8 καὶ ποιμένες ἦσαν ἐν τῇ χώρᾳ τῇ αὐτῇ ἀγραυλοῦντες καὶ φυλάσσοντες φυλακὰς τῆς νυκτὸς ἐπὶ τὴν ποίμνην αὐτῶν

This structure looks odd to me, but it may just be my unfamiliarity with the text.

Is agrauluntes a hapax legomenom?

Why are we saying hsan en th Chwra, were in the land, and then adding themselves abiding in the field, and with an articular infinitive of watching doing the watching over the flocks?

Is that just a Greek way, or is it just weird?

If so, the English KJV translators did a masterful job of rendering it poetic. If one compares this with Homer, there is no comparison.

[All-American]

Originally Posted by Archaea

2:8 καὶ ποιμένες ἦσαν ἐν τῇ χώρᾳ τῇ αὐτῇ ἀγραυλοῦντες καὶ φυλάσσοντες φυλακὰς τῆς νυκτὸς ἐπὶ τὴν ποίμνην αὐτῶν

This structure looks odd to me, but it may just be my unfamiliarity with the text.

Is agrauluntes a hapax legomenom?

Why are we saying hsan en th Chwra, were in the land, and then adding themselves abiding in the field, and with an articular infinitive of watching doing the watching over the flocks?

Is that just a Greek way, or is it just weird?

If so, the English KJV translators did a masterful job of rendering it poetic. If one compares this with Homer, there is no comparison.

αὐτῇ is an attributive adjective modifying χώρᾳ. There aren't any infinitives in the sentence; φυλάσσοντες is a circumstantial participle, whose direct object is φυλακὰς. It is a cognate accusative, which is not uncommon in Greek.

But no, not nearly as poetic as Homer or the KJV.

My translation:

And there were shepherds who were out in that land keeping the night's watch over their flocks.

[Archaea]

keeping the night's watch sounds better than how I would have translated it. How did Seattle ever get the idea that this was good Greek? Circumstantial participle?

I need to check those out.

It just sounds weird to have fulaktos and the similar word close to each other.

[All-American]

Originally Posted by Archaea

keeping the night's watch sounds better than how I would have translated it. How did Seattle ever get the idea that this was good Greek? Circumstantial participle?

I need to check those out.

It just sounds weird to have fulaktos and the similar word close to each other.

Yeah, cognate accusative. It's relatively common, but we don't like it in English. Rarely in English will one say that he "dreamed a dream," "fought a fight," or "drank a drink." My Greek teacher would always insist that if we found a cognate accusative, or found a verb with the object "tauta", you should translate it as you would in English: "had a dream," "got in a fight," "had a drink," "made this speech," etc.

[Archaea]

Originally Posted by All-American

Yeah, cognate accusative. It's relatively common, but we don't like it in English. Rarely in English will one say that he "dreamed a dream," "fought a fight," or "drank a drink." My Greek teacher would always insist that if we found a cognate accusative, or found a verb with the object "tauta", you should translate it as you would in English: "had a dream," "got in a fight," "had a drink," "made this speech," etc.

So in this instance, my English ear makes the Greek sound bad when it's okay in Greek?

Does anybody have a JSTOR account?

http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=000...3E2.0.CO%3B2-Z