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Old 10-20-2008, 02:42 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Goatnapper'96 View Post
Consistent with his military career, the cautious General. I don't know about now but when I still tracked these things he was the only 4 star General who had never commanded beyond Brigade, O-5 or FullBird Col, level and whose command OERs were less than spectacular.

I would probably have voted for him as well but I stand with Archaea, Collin is a bit of what one might call a pussie.

The genius of the Gulf War was Schwarzkopf, he is the one whose strategy the history books will revere. Collin was good for the press with his "first we are going to cut it off then we are going to kill it."

I also think Collin's academic reputation is in the realm of McCain's. Powell is a good lackey and if Bush was lying, which I don't believe he was, Collin does not strike me as bright enough to catch on. But hey he loves Obama....WOOOOOOOOOO!
Schwartzkopf was the military genius who got jobbed on the issue of helicopters.

Colin is a politician, as you have to be at that level. It is a loss, but if McCain had been a clear winner, you would have seen Colin declare for McCain. Because it's vogue, I wouldn't be surprised to see him declare himself a Democrat as well.
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Old 10-20-2008, 03:08 PM   #22
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In part, yes. But Powell would have had a seat at the table either way. He's been advising Obama for two years now. I do believe he was holding his cards as long as possible, though, just to leave his options open.

But one of the reasons Powell's endorsement came so late was because of Palin. Powell has never been a fan of the social conservatives -- he's referred to neocons in scathing and even profane terms in the past. I think he was awfully disappointed to watch his old friend McCain sell out on every single issue to the party line. Then to watch McCain make a VP selection specifically to pander to the most socially conservative voting base -- and to watch that selection prove herself unsuited for office in nearly every respect -- I think that was the final straw.

Also, if you look over Powell's history, Obama is really a better foreign policy fit for Powell.

Some would assert that his endorsement was racially motivated, and race is certainly a factor in this election. But to suggest that Powell's endorsement is primarily due to race is to overlook that fact that this announcement is consistent with years of Powell's record of preferring diplomacy over war, and of rejecting the neocon hijacking of the Republican Party.

That is hysterical, powell waited for Palin to implode before making his announcement? LOL

Powell is just pandering to get himself back in the limelight, something to make himself relevant again.

Congrats powell, you made you commitment, you now have a seat at the table to continue making $$$ off your public service.
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Old 10-20-2008, 06:09 PM   #23
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But one of the reasons Powell's endorsement came so late was because of Palin. Powell has never been a fan of the social conservatives -- he's referred to neocons in scathing and even profane terms in the past. I think he was awfully disappointed to watch his old friend McCain sell out on every single issue to the party line. Then to watch McCain make a VP selection specifically to pander to the most socially conservative voting base -- and to watch that selection prove herself unsuited for office in nearly every respect -- I think that was the final straw.
Then why no endorsement when Palin was all the rage? If he believes as you say, then that would have had some impact, undercutting the momentum McCain got from Palin. He could have finally taken on those social conservatives. This thing could have been over back then and that $150 million Obama got last month could have been better spent simulating the economy.
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Old 10-20-2008, 06:22 PM   #24
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Then why no endorsement when Palin was all the rage? If he believes as you say, then that would have had some impact, undercutting the momentum McCain got from Palin. He could have finally taken on those social conservatives. This thing could have been over back then and that $150 million Obama got last month could have been better spent simulating the economy.
Probably because he wanted to see what she was really like, given that few knew anything about her.
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Old 10-20-2008, 06:38 PM   #25
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Because it's vogue, I wouldn't be surprised to see him declare himself a Democrat as well.
It seems he's burned every bridge imaginable to the GOP, but I'd be surprised if he became a full Dem. At heart, I think Powell is really an independent centrist.
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Old 10-20-2008, 06:54 PM   #26
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Then why no endorsement when Palin was all the rage? If he believes as you say, then that would have had some impact, undercutting the momentum McCain got from Palin. He could have finally taken on those social conservatives. This thing could have been over back then and that $150 million Obama got last month could have been better spent simulating the economy.
Like I said, he was clearly holding his cards til the very end.

As far as Palin goes, when she was "all the rage" it wasn't yet clear just how woefully unprepared she was. If you believe Powell (and it's hard to take anything straight when it's coming from a politician), he wasn't concerned only because she represents the aspect of the party that he finds most reprehensible. He was concerned because of that and her spectacular implosion over the last month, as well as what those together imply about McCain's judgment and capacity for decision making.

But the truth is, Powell has been riding the fence for a year now. As Y pointed out months ago, Powell donated the maximum to McCain's campaign. At the same time, he was serving as an advisor to Obama. Powell clearly wanted to bet on the winning horse. He held out and only now is he placing all his money on Obama just as the windows are closing. Or more accurately, just as Obama is coming around the final turn ahead by several lengths with McCain fading fast.

I'm not trying to suggest Powell has done anything bold or daring here. It's pretty clearly rather the opposite. But what is being much overlooked in the publicity is the extent to which the endorsement of Obama really is consistent with Powell's record.
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Old 10-20-2008, 06:58 PM   #27
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Like I said, he was clearly holding his cards til the very end.

As far as Palin goes, when she was "all the rage" it wasn't yet clear just how woefully unprepared she was. If you believe Powell (and it's hard to take anything straight when it's coming from a politician), he wasn't concerned only because she represents the aspect of the party that he finds most reprehensible. He was concerned because of that and her spectacular implosion over the last month, as well as what those together imply about McCain's judgment and capacity for decision making.

But the truth is, Powell has been riding the fence for a year now. As Y pointed out months ago, Powell donated the maximum to McCain's campaign. At the same time, he was serving as an advisor to Obama. Powell clearly wanted to bet on the winning horse. He held out and only now is he placing all his money on Obama just as the windows are closing. Or more accurately, just as Obama is coming around the final turn ahead by several lengths with McCain fading fast.

I'm not trying to suggest Powell has done anything bold or daring here. It's pretty clearly rather the opposite. But what is being much overlooked in the publicity is the extent to which the endorsement of Obama really is consistent with Powell's record.
Not being familiar with Powell's public posture, you've made a case that he's consistent. What I don't know is to what extent he's been inconsistent with those pronouncements. You probably know better.
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Old 10-20-2008, 07:04 PM   #28
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Not being familiar with Powell's public posture, you've made a case that he's consistent. What I don't know is to what extent he's been inconsistent with those pronouncements. You probably know better.
I doubt it. I don't even know what that post means.
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Old 10-20-2008, 07:06 PM   #29
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I doubt it. I don't even know what that post means.
My bad.

You've made a persuasive showing that Powell choosing Obama is being consistent with Powell's public policy pronouncements.

I'm not familiar enough with Powell's public statements to know if Powell has been consistent in his policy pronouncements. That's all I was saying. Powell seems a bit all over the place trying to cover all the bases, but perhaps I misread him.
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Old 10-20-2008, 07:12 PM   #30
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My bad...
I knew what you meant. To me, it just didn't make sense as a response to what I posted. If I suggest that Powell's endorsement is consistent with his history, then it seems fair to infer that I believe there's a pattern well enough established that one could determine whether his endorsement follows.
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