Revelation 11

[MikeWaters]

Israel:

[il Padrino Ute]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

Israel:

I will not defend the disgusting actions talked about in this video.

[Tex]

Of the two, only one side has taken efforts to minimize innocent casualties, and that side is not Hamas.

[Cougar Hunter]

The International Red Cross was so outraged it broke its usual silence over an attack in which the Israeli army herded a Palestinian family into a building and then shelled it, killing 30 people and leaving the surviving children clinging to the bodies of their dead mothers. The army prevented rescuers from reaching the survivors for four days.

LINK

Hell of an effort there.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by Cougar Hunter

LINK

Hell of an effort there.

I refuse to engage in a dead-baby-picture war with you, ala il Pad and Waters. There are usually two sides to these stories, but for the sake of argument: on the occasion when war atrocities are committed by the Israelis, they pale in number and in magnitude to those committed by Hamas and/or other Palestinian terrorists. The hypocrisy of "world outrage" is stunning.

All loss of innocent life is tragic. But let's not be intellectually lazy and suggest that both sides cause (or threaten) such loss in equal portions.

[Cougar Hunter]

Originally Posted by Tex

I refuse to engage in a dead-baby-picture war with you, ala il Pad and Waters. There are usually two sides to these stories, but for the sake of argument: on the occasion when war atrocities are committed by the Israelis, they pale in number and in magnitude to those committed by Hamas and/or other Palestinian terrorists. The hypocrisy of "world outrage" is stunning.

All loss of innocent life is tragic. But let's not be intellectually lazy and suggest that both sides cause (or threaten) such loss in equal portions.

I'm not suggesting that the Palestinians are without blame. Israel certainly should defend itself from Hamas provocation. They are in a desperate situation in Gaza and desperate people do desperate things.

However it's clear that Israel has used the situation to get as many licks as it can it before Bush heads for the ranch. Strong allegations of war crimes in this last offensive have been coming out, not just from Palestinian sources.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by Cougar Hunter

I'm not suggesting that the Palestinians are without blame. Israel certainly should defend itself from Hamas provocation. They are in a desperate situation in Gaza and desperate people do desperate things.

However it's clear that Israel has used the situation to get as many licks as it can it before Bush heads for the ranch. Strong allegations of war crimes in this last offensive have been coming out, not just from Palestinian sources.

Pardon my skepticism but that's not exactly unusual.

Israel has nothing to gain from shoving 30 innocent women and children into a house and blowing it up. I mean seriously, give me a break. Their biggest problem has been differentiating legitimate military targets from civilian targets, in part because the Palestinians love to blur the two.

That's not to say no Israeli soldier and/or commander has ever crossed the line. I'm simply looking for a sense of proportion badly missing among the Israel-haters.

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by Tex

Pardon my skepticism but that's not exactly unusual.

Israel has nothing to gain from shoving 30 innocent women and children into a house and blowing it up. I mean seriously, give me a break. Their biggest problem has been differentiating legitimate military targets from civilian targets, in part because the Palestinians love to blur the two.

That's not to say no Israeli soldier and/or commander has ever crossed the line. I'm simply looking for a sense of proportion badly missing among the Israel-haters.

Tom Friedman gave justification and explained the utility of targeting civilians in the Times.

So I take it you do not agree with Friedman.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

Tom Friedman gave justification and explained the utility of targeting civilians in the Times.

So I take it you do not agree with Friedman.

I'd have to read exactly what he said because I don't trust your characterization of just about anything.

But speaking broadly, I disagree with Friedman on a lot of things.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

Tom Friedman gave justification and explained the utility of targeting civilians in the Times.

So I take it you do not agree with Friedman.

Speaking of Friedman, I ran across this hilarious takedown of the guy. Warning, there's some free use of explicatives.

A snippet:

Like The World is Flat, a book borne of Friedman’s stirring experience of seeing IBM sign in the distance while golfing in Bangalore, Hot,Flat and Crowded is a book whose great insights come when Friedman golfs (on global warming allowing him more winter golf days:“I will still take advantage of it—but I no longer think of it as something I got for free”), looks at Burger King signs (upon seeing a “nightmarish neon blur” of KFC, BK and McDonald’s signs in Texas, he realizes: “We’re on a fool’s errand”), and reads bumper stickers (the “Osama Loves your SUV” sticker he read turns into the thesis of his “Fill ‘er up with Dictators” chapter). This is Friedman’s life: He flies around the world, eats pricey lunches with other rich people and draws conclusions about the future of humanity by looking out his hotel window and counting the Applebee’s signs.

... and ...

Friedman then draws his napkin-graph, and much to the pundit’s surprise, it turns out that there is almost an exact correlation between high oil prices and “unfreedom”! The graph contains two lines, one showing a rising and then descending slope of “freedom,” and one showing a descending and then rising course of oil prices.

Friedman plots exactly four points on the graph over the course of those 30 years. In 1989, as oil prices are falling, Friedman writes, “Berlin Wall Torn Down.” In 1993, again as oil prices are low, he writes, “Nigeria Privatizes First Oil Field.” 1997, oil prices still low, “Iran Calls for Dialogue of Civilizations.” Then, finally, 2005, a year of high oil prices: “Iran calls for Israel’s destruction.”Take a look for yourself: I looked at this and thought: “Gosh, what a neat trick!” Then I sat down and drew up my own graph, called SIZE OF VALERIE BERTINELLI’S ASS, 1985-2008, vs. HAPPINESS. It turns out that there is an almost exact correlation! Note the four points on the graph:

The graph is priceless.

Full disclosure: I own and actually enjoyed Friedman's early From Beruit to Jerusalem, except for the final chapter where he gets all Millennial and New World Order-ish.