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Old 09-23-2008, 03:10 AM   #21
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Bah. Come on, SU. Did you even read the end of the piece? Japan and Germany aren't taking any action because 1) They've already pumped billions into their banks over the summer and 2) they can't do anything.

Once again the Anglo-American allies have to clean up after the party that everyone attended but no one stayed around to put away the chairs.

Even if we're wrong (the Fed and Treasury) you don't want to be seen rooting for the EU, sorry.
They've put "billions" in? You don't say. $700 billion? The article says at the end that Europe's losses are much less severe than the U.S.'s, perhaps as low as $75 billion, and one thing no one is happy about is that worldwide this is a mess created by American institutions. The Germans claim they saw it coming, and we rejected their call for tougher oversight. Even the UK is telling us to shove it, which is something. The cul-de-sac quotation refers to EU regulations that would preclude a bail out.

I don't blame them. I'm not proud of these financial institutions that fell prey to the moral hazard of short term gains and riches for their principals just for making loans regardless of due dilligence.
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Old 09-23-2008, 03:38 AM   #22
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They've put "billions" in? You don't say. $700 billion? The article says at the end that Europe's losses are much less severe than the U.S.'s, perhaps as low as $75 billion, and one thing no one is happy about is that worldwide this is a mess created by American institutions. The Germans claim they saw it coming, and we rejected their call for tougher oversight. Even the UK is telling us to shove it, which is something. The cul-de-sac quotation refers to EU regulations that would preclude a bail out.

I don't blame them. I'm not proud of these financial institutions that fell prey to the moral hazard of short term gains and riches for their principals just for making loans regardless of due dilligence.
Now I really know you don't believe what you're writing. Why would any good Torrey give a f' what the Germans think about how we make or lose our money.

And you need to bust out your Friedman again, because the moral hazard of this crisis has nothing to do with short vs. long term profits - it's all about risk being divorced from the lender.
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Old 09-23-2008, 04:31 AM   #23
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Now I really know you don't believe what you're writing. Why would any good Torrey give a f' what the Germans think about how we make or lose our money.

And you need to bust out your Friedman again, because the moral hazard of this crisis has nothing to do with short vs. long term profits - it's all about risk being divorced from the lender.
There's moral hazard all over the place.
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Old 09-23-2008, 05:35 AM   #24
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I don't know what kind of site it is, nor if those descriptions are accurate.

I had heard that it was common for the apostles to have second homes in Utah. I can't remember the source.

I mean, is this a shock to anyone if it is true?

This is a church where it is a running joke that if you are wealthy you will eventually be a bishop or a stake president. That tells you something.
It's an anti site, Mike. And you used it to back up your claims.

So what if it is true? Does that make them less righteous?

Or are you jealous that you don't have a 2nd home? Perhaps you're impatient and want a 2nd home now and aren't willing to work for it, so you rail against those who do?

If GAs have 2nd homes, it tells me exactly the same thing that my in-laws having a 2nd home tells me - that they worked their butts off during their careers in order to not have to worry about an income during their retirement years. Is that really so bad?
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Old 09-23-2008, 12:34 PM   #25
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It's an anti site, Mike. And you used it to back up your claims.

So what if it is true? Does that make them less righteous?

Or are you jealous that you don't have a 2nd home? Perhaps you're impatient and want a 2nd home now and aren't willing to work for it, so you rail against those who do?

If GAs have 2nd homes, it tells me exactly the same thing that my in-laws having a 2nd home tells me - that they worked their butts off during their careers in order to not have to worry about an income during their retirement years. Is that really so bad?
I think per the church, it's not bad to have any number of homes and toys as long as you can afford it.
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Old 09-23-2008, 01:38 PM   #26
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my house looks to be much smaller than these houses.

http://www.salamandersociety.com/foyer/gamap/

I can only guess as to why they don't speak out very much against materialism. Getting into debt and materialism are different, though often related, things.
Despite the site's efforts to talk up the "great views" and "cul-de-sacs", few of these homes look ostentatious at all. I don't expect to see photos of President Monson's rambler anytime on Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous. It looks like the home that everyone's great-uncle LaVerl lives in. And Midway, while nice, is no Aspen.

My current home is nice, but nothing special. I paid less than two times my annual salary for it. But if you put it up on that website, there are probably only about 5 homes that look nicer. Materialism might very well be a problem in the Church, but if the best that the enemies of the Church can do is link to pics of normal looking condos with "gorgeious views of the Salt Lake Valley", I see no evidence that the General Authorities have fallen prey to it.
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Old 09-23-2008, 01:48 PM   #27
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Despite the site's efforts to talk up the "great views" and "cul-de-sacs", few of these homes look ostentatious at all. I don't expect to see photos of President Monson's rambler anytime on Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous. It looks like the home that everyone's great-uncle LaVerl lives in. And Midway, while nice, is no Aspen.

My current home is nice, but nothing special. I paid less than two times my annual salary for it. But if you put it up on that website, there are probably only about 5 homes that look nicer. Materialism might very well be a problem in the Church, but if the best that the enemies of the Church can do is link to pics of normal looking condos with "gorgeious views of the Salt Lake Valley", I see no evidence that the General Authorities have fallen prey to it.
we don't know what role finances play in the lives of the GAs, as well as within the church itself, since its financials have not been made public since the era of "baseball baptisms" and the church's impending bankruptcy.
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Old 09-23-2008, 01:52 PM   #28
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Despite the site's efforts to talk up the "great views" and "cul-de-sacs", few of these homes look ostentatious at all. I don't expect to see photos of President Monson's rambler anytime on Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous. It looks like the home that everyone's great-uncle LaVerl lives in. And Midway, while nice, is no Aspen.
What, you're not impressed with President Monson's one-car garage home in Millcreek? Or how about the fact that President Faust, though he held office as a Democrat, lived in the same building as the Utah GOP? That tells you something doesn't it? And even though L. Tom Perry's condo building looks like a parking garage, I bet it's really nice. While the rest of us toil away in our lowly callings, living in squalor, the GA's get to enjoy their nice views of the Salt Lake Valley from their condo balcony. Makes me sick.
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Old 09-23-2008, 01:55 PM   #29
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What, you're not impressed with President Monson's one-car garage home in Millcreek? Or how about the fact that President Faust, though he held office as a Democrat, lived in the same building as the Utah GOP? That tells you something doesn't it? And even though L. Tom Perry's condo building looks like a parking garage, I bet it's really nice. While the rest of us toil away in our lowly callings, living in squalor, the GA's get to enjoy their nice views of the Salt Lake Valley from their condo balcony. Makes me sick.
lol. No kidding. That was a fun read.
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Old 09-23-2008, 02:21 PM   #30
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What, you're not impressed with President Monson's one-car garage home in Millcreek? Or how about the fact that President Faust, though he held office as a Democrat, lived in the same building as the Utah GOP? That tells you something doesn't it? And even though L. Tom Perry's condo building looks like a parking garage, I bet it's really nice. While the rest of us toil away in our lowly callings, living in squalor, the GA's get to enjoy their nice views of the Salt Lake Valley from their condo balcony. Makes me sick.
it's a pro-Mormon site.
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