I would like to thank Landpoke

[il Padrino Ute]

Originally Posted by YOhio

Here is the most powerful conservation group in Utah. Much better than SUWA.

http://www.rmef.org/

Agreed. This group at least does something.

[Levin]

Originally Posted by YOhio

Here is the most powerful conservation group in Utah. Much better than SUWA.

http://www.rmef.org/

From RMEF's website:

"We neither support nor oppose the federal wolf recovery program, but we do favor existing plans to remove wolves from the endangered species list so they can be managed locally by state wildlife agencies."

In other words, they support the eradication of the gray wolf. That is totally inconsistent with their desire for a healthy and strong elk population. The wolves take out the sick, old, and laggardly among the elk herds. In fact, the wolf and other predators like it played a large part in shaping the evolution of the elk into the majestic beast that it is.

Just more kowtowing to local ranchers who can't spare a cow every now and then WHEN WILDLIFE GROUPS HAVE PROGRAMS TO COMPENSATE THEM FOR ANY CATTLE LOSS RESULTING FROM A WOLF ATTACK.

[il Padrino Ute]

Originally Posted by YOhio

Here is the most powerful conservation group in Utah. Much better than SUWA.

http://www.rmef.org/

Originally Posted by Levin

From RMEF's website:

"We neither support nor oppose the federal wolf recovery program, but we do favor existing plans to remove wolves from the endangered species list so they can be managed locally by state wildlife agencies."

In other words, they support the eradication of the gray wolf. That is totally inconsistent with their desire for a healthy and strong elk population. The wolves take out the sick, old, and laggardly among the elk herds. In fact, the wolf and other predators like it played a large part in shaping the evolution of the elk into the majestic beast that it is.

Just more kowtowing to local ranchers who can't spare a cow every now and then WHEN WILDLIFE GROUPS HAVE PROGRAMS TO COMPENSATE THEM FOR ANY CATTLE LOSS RESULTING FROM A WOLF ATTACK.

What is the compensation for lost cattle of which you speak? Link?

[Levin]

Originally Posted by il Padrino Ute

What is the compensation for lost cattle of which you speak? Link?

http://www.defenders.org/programs_an...nsation_trust/

"A notable scheme in the US was started by Defenders of Wildlife, a non-government organisation. Their Wolf Compensation Trust was created in 1987 to pay compensation when wolves were reintroduced to Yellowstone National Park and the Northern Rockies. The Trust fund of $100,000, started by donations from individuals interested in wolf recovery, pays the market value of livestock verified by federal investigators as killed by wolves. Payments were expanded in 1995 to cover the reintroduction of wolves to Arizona and New Mexico.

According to Defenders of Wildlife, in the 13 years from the Wolf Compensation Trust's inception to 2000, it has paid $136,627 to 129 ranchers for 529 depredation incidents (for at least 167 cattle, 338 sheep and some dozens of other animals including pigs and fowl). This amounts to an average of $235 dollars per animal lost to wolves. The Trust also provides guarding dogs, fences and other depredation prevention measures for livestock ranchers."

[Levin]

Those stats I quoted before are old.

Total number of payments from 1987 to June 2008: $1,100,122

see http://www.defenders.org/resources/p...tion_trust.pdf

As Defenders of Wildlife states, "Our goal is to shift economic responsibility for wolf recovery away from the individual rancher and toward the millions of people who want to see the wolf populations restored. When ranchers alone are forced to bear the cost of wolf recovery, it creates animosity and ill will toward the wolf."

So does ignorance, as this discussion has shown . . .

[MikeWaters]

I knew exactly what I was doing. Yes, I donated to a militant conservation group that is going to sue the hell out of people and companies that rape the environment. And they will lobby as well. Hopefully we can get another few national parks in the next administration.

[Levin]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

I knew exactly what I was doing. Yes, I donated to a militant conservation group that is going to sue the hell out of people and companies that rape the environment. And they will lobby as well. Hopefully we can get another few national parks in the next administration.

Best prospect is the Maine Woods; timber companies are selling off huge tracts of land, and it is a priceless opportunity to create an amazing national park in central and northern Maine.

See http://www.restore.org/Maine/overview.html

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

I knew exactly what I was doing. Yes, I donated to a militant conservation group that is going to sue the hell out of people and companies that rape the environment. And they will lobby as well. Hopefully we can get another few national parks in the next administration.

Typical doctor. I hate all lawyers except my lawyers.

[Levin]

Landpoke -- so you believed that it's not worth cutting into ranchers' profits for a garbage animal like the wolf. You were obviously ignorant of the Wolf Compensation Fund noted above. Does that change your opinion?

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

Typical doctor. I hate all lawyers except my lawyers.

THe problem with you is you are fighting on the wrong side. You help corporations rape the environment.