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Old 03-10-2008, 04:14 PM   #31
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They should be punished the way that people are normally punished in that area for similar crimes. No more, no less.
It's a hate crime. They should be punished the way Klansmen are punished for burning crosses, plus for property damage. (Truth is hate crimes are kind of silly and questionable per the 1st amendment whre there is just expression.)
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Old 03-10-2008, 04:23 PM   #32
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It's a hate crime. They should be punished the way Klansmen are punished for burning crosses, plus for property damage. (Truth is hate crimes are kind of silly and questionable per the 1st amendment whre there is just expression.)
I agree with Mike and disagree with Seattle. Hate crimes seem of questionable validity and they are mostly political expressions, rather than practical adjudications of law.
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Old 03-10-2008, 04:53 PM   #33
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Was President Hinckley appealing to mercy witout respect for the demands of justice in that talk? Am I?
Tooblue?

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Tex, knowing almost nothing about the situation, demands that justice not be applied.

Funny.
I "demanded"?
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Old 03-10-2008, 05:03 PM   #34
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There have been several similar incidents. The most famous one was in Thailand. The elders sat on a statue of Buddha. They were turned in by the photo store. The pictures were put on the front page of newpapers and the public was outraged. At least one of the elders was thrown in jail and was there for quite some time. The incident happened in the 1970s. Even in the 1990s, the pictures would periodically be republished and public outrage would cycle up again and the missionaries would have to spend several days in their apartments and wait out the storm of outrage. I haven't been back to Thailand since 1996 so I don't know what the status is lately.
I always assumed this one was urban-legendy.

The way you describe it pretty much ensures its urban legend status because you seem to be implying the existence of widespread, published photographic evidence, missionaries being imprisoned, etc, and a newspaper periodically republishing pictures. Maybe my google search is broken, but I cant find any reference to it.

Verdict: 100% urban legend.
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Old 03-10-2008, 05:15 PM   #35
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I agree with Mike and disagree with Seattle. Hate crimes seem of questionable validity and they are mostly political expressions, rather than practical adjudications of law.
I agree with you as I noted in my amendment ot my post, on a broad policy level. But treating them the same as everyone else may mean treating their crime as a hate crime. I knew a successful lawyer who lost some friends in the World Trade Center on 9/11 (he worked at Brown and Wood and with an investment banking form on the 100+ level). That night he got way drunk, drove to the mosque by his house, tramped in without taking off his shoes, and then shouted insults at the worshipers. He was charged with a federal hate crime, a felony. He may have copped a plea for less, but he was fired from his firm, etc. Last I heard he was selling life insurance.

These missionaries' act was ultimately an expression of hatred. It wasn't just vandalism. If hate crimes are on the books and people are being prosecuted for them, the prosecutor should treat these missionaries no different.
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Old 03-10-2008, 05:19 PM   #36
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I agree with you as I noted in my amendment ot my post, on a broad policy level. But treating them the same as everyone else may mean treating their crime as a hate crime. I knew a successful lawyer who lost some friends in the World Trade Center on 9/11 (he worked at Brown and Wood and with an investment banking form on the 100+ level). That night he got way drunk, drove to the mosque by his house, tramped in without taking off his shoes, and then shouted insults at the worshipers. He was charged with a federal hate crime, a felony. He may have copped a plea for less, but he was fired from his firm, etc. Last I heard he was selling life insurance.

These missionaries' act was ultimately an expression of hatred. It wasn't just vandalism. If hate crimes are on the books and people are being prosecuted for them, the prosecutor should treat these missionaries no different.
as long as you will agree that throwing beer cans in the general vicinity of missionaries, with the intent to strike, is also a hate crime.
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Old 03-10-2008, 05:24 PM   #37
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I always assumed this one was urban-legendy.

The way you describe it pretty much ensures its urban legend status because you seem to be implying the existence of widespread, published photographic evidence, missionaries being imprisoned, etc, and a newspaper periodically republishing pictures. Maybe my google search is broken, but I cant find any reference to it.

Verdict: 100% urban legend.
You need to fix your google.

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Old 03-10-2008, 05:24 PM   #38
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as long as you will agree that throwing beer cans in the general vicinity of missionaries, with the intent to strike, is also a hate crime.
Empty ones? That's kind of a lame example, don't you think?
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Old 03-10-2008, 05:37 PM   #39
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beer bottles.
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Old 03-10-2008, 05:48 PM   #40
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I had beer bottles thrown at me. Cups filled with urine thrown at me. A basketball in a passing car thrown at me. Dogs sicked on me. Had someone try to run me off the road. Had a knife pulled on me. Been flashed by obese women (by far the worst offense). Had a gun pulled on me. Had loogies hawked at me.

All when I was a missionary.

Course probably had more to do with my engaging personality.

For the record: The dopes should be punished to the fullest extent of the law and clearly be held accountable for their actions. Few things rub me more the wrong way than when others refuse to take accountability for their actions, and then only do so when they've been busted instead of showing true remorse.
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