Let me ask one of the forbidden questions... - cougarguard.com — unofficial BYU Cougars / LDS sports, football, basketball forum and message board

MikeWaters · 11-30-2007, 08:18 PM

Was it right for western powers to create a Jewish state, where no Jewish state existed?

An analogy might be something like this: the United States feels bad for Cubans and creates a Cuban country in Florida, or Puerto Rico. Some Floridians and Puerto Ricans might be perturbed.

Based on my reading, what you have is wave after wave of immigration, Jews to Palestine, but the Jews are still in the minority. Then Britain creates a new state, war erupts, people flee their homes, and afterwards homes and property are confiscated. Am I reading this wrong?

Quote:

In 1947, the British government withdrew from commitment to the Mandate of Palestine, stating it was unable to arrive at a solution acceptable to both Arabs and Jews.[49] The newly-created United Nations approved the UN Partition Plan (United Nations General Assembly Resolution 181) on November 29, 1947, dividing the country into two states, one Arab and one Jewish. Jerusalem was to be designated an international city – a corpus separatum – administered by the UN to avoid conflict over its status.[50] The Jewish community accepted the plan,[51] but the Arab League and Arab Higher Committee rejected it.[52]

Regardless, the State of Israel was proclaimed on May 14, 1948, one day before the expiry of the British Mandate for Palestine.[53] Not long after, five Arab countries – Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon and Iraq – attacked Israel, launching the 1948 Arab-Israeli War.[53] After almost a year of fighting, a ceasefire was declared and temporary borders, known as the Green Line, were instituted. Jordan annexed what became known as the West Bank and East Jerusalem, and Egypt took control of the Gaza Strip. Israel was admitted as a member of the United Nations on May 11, 1949.[54] During the course of the hostilities, 711,000 Arabs, according to UN estimates, fled from Israel.[55] The fate of the Palestinian refugees today is a major point of contention in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.[56][57]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel

SeattleUte · 11-30-2007, 08:28 PM

Deuteronomy 30:3, "That then the Lord thy God will turn thy captivity, and have compassion upon thee, and will return and gather thee from all the nations, whither the Lord thy God hath scattered thee."

Psalms 107:3, "And gathered them out of the lands, from the east, and from the west, from the north, and from the south."

Isaiah 54:7, "For a small moment have I forsaken thee; but with great mercies will I gather thee."

Ezekiel 28:25, "Thus saith the Lord God; When I shall have gathered the house of Israel from the people among whom they are scattered, ..."

John 11:52, "And not for that nation only, but that also he should gather together in one the children of God that were scattered abroad."

MikeWaters · 11-30-2007, 08:31 PM

Yeah too bad they weren't gathered to a place where they could build their own homes and streets and cities, instead of taking over stuff that was already there.

There would be many more Americans alive today.

Indy Coug · 11-30-2007, 08:35 PM

What's the problem Mike? Certainly their 20th century repatriation was a helluva lot more humane and less invasive than what God had them up to with Joshua, Saul and company.

myboynoah · 11-30-2007, 08:39 PM

We should have never kicked the Ottomans out of the Middle East. It seems things ran much better when they were in charge.

K-dog · 11-30-2007, 08:45 PM

Bottom line, no one likes to ask the question because no one likes the answer. It makes no sense. Only the supreme guilt resulting from WWII has the ability to make this decision seem logical.

SeattleUte · 11-30-2007, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by K-dog

Bottom line, no one likes to ask the question because no one likes the answer. It makes no sense. Only the supreme guilt resulting from WWII has the ability to make this decision seem logical.

That was a factor but it may have been the least of the reasons. Other perhaps more important factors were Truman's biblical literalism, the fact that his lifelong friend Eddie Jacobson was a Jew, and Jews' powerful political clout in this country.

MikeWaters · 11-30-2007, 08:56 PM

If the Jews won't compromise, then they deserve their suffering. Building new settlements in occupied territories was outrageous, and I'm glad they are dismantling those.

Archaea · 11-30-2007, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

If the Jews won't compromise, then they deserve their suffering. Building new settlements in occupied territories was outrageous, and I'm glad they are dismantling those.

Kinda harsh, but I've always figured that the Jews should have considered the South American option. I agree it was a mistake, a mistake born out of guilt, and one which we are suffering from even now.

SeattleUte · 11-30-2007, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Archaea

I agree it was a mistake, a mistake born out of guilt.

That wasn't the only reason. Do you read my posts? It's right above yours.

11-30-2007, 08:28 PM	#2
SeattleUte fairlds.org Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 10,665	Deuteronomy 30:3, "That then the Lord thy God will turn thy captivity, and have compassion upon thee, and will return and gather thee from all the nations, whither the Lord thy God hath scattered thee." Psalms 107:3, "And gathered them out of the lands, from the east, and from the west, from the north, and from the south." Isaiah 54:7, "For a small moment have I forsaken thee; but with great mercies will I gather thee." Ezekiel 28:25, "Thus saith the Lord God; When I shall have gathered the house of Israel from the people among whom they are scattered, ..." John 11:52, "And not for that nation only, but that also he should gather together in one the children of God that were scattered abroad." __________________ Interrupt all you like. We're involved in a complicated story here, and not everything is quite what it seems to be. —Paul Auster

11-30-2007, 08:39 PM	#5
myboynoah Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Memphis freakin' Tennessee!!!!! Posts: 4,530	We should have never kicked the Ottomans out of the Middle East. It seems things ran much better when they were in charge. __________________ Give 'em Hell, Cougars!!! Religion rises inevitably from our apprehension of our own death. To give meaning to meaninglessness is the endless quest of all religion. When death becomes the center of our consciousness, then religion authentically begins. Of all religions that I know, the one that most vehemently and persuasively defies and denies the reality of death is the original Mormonism of the Prophet, Seer and Revelator, Joseph Smith.

11-30-2007, 08:45 PM	#6
K-dog Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Salt Lake City Posts: 699	Bottom line, no one likes to ask the question because no one likes the answer. It makes no sense. Only the supreme guilt resulting from WWII has the ability to make this decision seem logical. __________________ He's down by the creek, walkin' on water. K-dog P.S. Grrrrrrrrr

11-30-2007, 08:31 PM	#3
MikeWaters Demiurge Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 36,365	Yeah too bad they weren't gathered to a place where they could build their own homes and streets and cities, instead of taking over stuff that was already there. There would be many more Americans alive today.

11-30-2007, 08:35 PM	#4
Indy Coug Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Between Iraq and a hard place Posts: 7,569	What's the problem Mike? Certainly their 20th century repatriation was a helluva lot more humane and less invasive than what God had them up to with Joshua, Saul and company.

11-30-2007, 08:56 PM	#8
MikeWaters Demiurge Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 36,365	If the Jews won't compromise, then they deserve their suffering. Building new settlements in occupied territories was outrageous, and I'm glad they are dismantling those.