Heavenly visions or visitations?

[bluegoose]

I just had a thought recently that is probably not a difficult question, but the answer currently evades me.

Is it possible to receive or observe a heavenly visitation/manifestation with one's “natural” eyes, or is some sort of transfiguration required? I'm referring strictly to those who claim to have witnessed the Father, the Son or an actual angel in their midst.

My original question came when thinking about the first vision of Joseph Smith. Many have referred to it as a visitation, while others maintain it was a vision. The same question could be asked with regard to Paul, the brother of Jared and others. If I were present, but not the intended recipient of the visitation, would I observe the same thing as those to whom the visitation was meant, or would I simply observe the individual receiving the visitation?

I have some thoughts on the subject, but am curious as to what some of the others may feel on the subject.

[MikeWaters]

Not sure. But as a little kid, I had the whole "ask him to shake your hand" thing down pat.

No way I was going to be fooled!

[Robin]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

Not sure. But as a little kid, I had the whole "ask him to shake your hand" thing down pat.

No way I was going to be fooled!

I will file that under 'crazy ideas that my son will not have to endure'.

[SteelBlue]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

Not sure. But as a little kid, I had the whole "ask him to shake your hand" thing down pat.

No way I was going to be fooled!

LOL me too! Times have certainly changed.

[MikeWaters]

I was sort of joking.

But I don't think it is ridiculous. I believe it 100%.

I've been in the crucible, and I know where my heart is.

[Hazzard]

Originally Posted by Robin

I will file that under 'crazy ideas that my son will not have to endure'.

Did anyone else find this comment ironic?

P.S. for Robin: I'm not a Robin-hater.

P.P.S. I still think the comment is ironic.

[myboynoah]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

Not sure. But as a little kid, I had the whole "ask him to shake your hand" thing down pat.

No way I was going to be fooled!

I always imagined a bunch of evil spirits standing in line at the time clock at the end of a hard days work work asking each other how it went.

"Not well, he got me with that handshake thing again."

"Damn, me too!"

[SteelBlue]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

I was sort of joking.

But I don't think it is ridiculous. I believe it 100%.

I've been in the crucible, and I know where my heart is.

My "times have changed" comment referred to that stuff not being talked about much anymore with kids.

[Robin]

Originally Posted by SteelBlue

My "times have changed" comment referred to that stuff not being talked about much anymore with kids.

So you guys really think that good and evil spirit beings come and visit the members of the church, and that the handshake trick is a good way to tell them apart?

Nothing in my personal spiritual/natural experience comes even close to supporting a belief in such things. Other than taking someone else at their word, has anyone else had any experience that would support the handshake 'doctrine?'

[All-American]

Originally Posted by Robin

Nothing in my personal spiritual/natural experience comes even close to supporting a belief in such things. Other than taking someone else at their word, has anyone else had any experience that would support the handshake 'doctrine?'

"I see nothing at all; yet all that is, I see."

There's no reason to say that simply because something hasn't entered into my personal realm of experience, such a thing doesn't exist or hasn't happened. I have plenty of other reasons to believe this to be true. Some of it is indirect (i.e., I believe that Joseph was a prophet), and some, more direct reasons to believe it. Let me say, however, that even if I had a personal experience which supported this doctrine, I wouldn't be discussing it on an internet sports board.