Perpetual Education Fund

[BYU71]

Originally Posted by K-dog

You should be more specific in your posting. Your post didn't indicate that at all. In fact, you probably only retroactively are saying that. Since that is now the point of your post, I see no argument against that either. We use guilt like a club to beat the youth into line, we pass around "sign up sheets" we do PPIs to make sure people do their home teaching and have family home evening. I don't think there is a question that we use guilt as a tool to help people make, what we consider, good choices. The real question is whether it is appropriate or inappropriate.

It actually is a good question. I think punishment is often stressed more than reward. Maybe those methods are the best way to keep a large group in line. Human beings are too flawed to use the reward or appeal to the better self method, especially human beings in the formative years.

[K-dog]

Originally Posted by BYU71

It actually is a good question. I think punishment is often stressed more than reward. Maybe those methods are the best way to keep a large group in line. Human beings are too flawed to use the reward or appeal to the better self method, especially human beings in the formative years.

I think generally, because guilt is a necessary part of true repentance, guilt is an appropriate tool. When over used, it loses its impact and/or clouds the issues and you end up with no other tool of influence. I think the other tools should be used in conjunction with guilt to try and help the individual "graduate" from needing guilt to drive him.

[BYU71]

Originally Posted by K-dog

I think generally, because guilt is a necessary part of true repentance, guilt is an appropriate tool. When over used, it loses its impact and/or clouds the issues and you end up with no other tool of influence. I think the other tools should be used in conjunction with guilt to try and help the individual "graduate" from needing guilt to drive him.

I think you are right. Guilt is the lower method that hopefully can be used to get a person in a position to move onto the higher method of motivation.

The guilt method while effective can be also the most ineffective. If a person realizes they didn't need to feel the guilt over something, they might decide the same for something they should really feel guilty for.

For instance, putting someone on a guilt trip for looking at a pretty cheerleader. When one realizes that is a bunch of crap to try and hoist that view on others. Then when you try to hoist the view looking at Playboy should make you feel guilty it lessens the effectiveness .

[Tex]

Originally Posted by K-dog

You should be more specific in your posting. Your post didn't indicate that at all. In fact, you probably only retroactively are saying that. Since that is now the point of your post, I see no argument against that either. We use guilt like a club to beat the youth into line, we pass around "sign up sheets" we do PPIs to make sure people do their home teaching and have family home evening. I don't think there is a question that we use guilt as a tool to help people make, what we consider, good choices. The real question is whether it is appropriate or inappropriate.

Apparently I was too subtle.

We have been explicity instructed as recently as 15 months ago NOT to use guilt to motivate.

Fourth, eliminate guilt. I hope it goes without saying that guilt is not a proper motivational technique for leaders and teachers of the gospel of Jesus Christ. We must always motivate through love and sincere appreciation, not by creating guilt. I like the thought "Catch others doing something right."

http://lds.org/conference/talk/displ...-646-7,00.html

You are conflating improper guilt-tripping as a motivation technique with the appropriate guilt someone should feel for being dishonest.

Thus, my sarcastic response.

[BYU71]

Originally Posted by Tex

Apparently I was too subtle.

We have been explicity instructed as recently as 15 months ago NOT to use guilt to motivate.



http://lds.org/conference/talk/displ...-646-7,00.html

You are conflating improper guilt-tripping as a motivation technique with the appropriate guilt someone should feel for being dishonest.

Thus, my sarcastic response.

That's great. It is interesting the kinds of things at conference or other places that get ignored and the kind of things that are looked at as critical. Although the church may teach the guilt trip isn't a good method, I think you would have to admit it has been institutionalized in the member behavior.

Same with the Prophets admonition how to treat those of other faiths and beliefs. A lot of members think that means to smile at them, but not really think their beliefs have any merit. They don't see it as a call not to look down on others.

[nikuman]

Originally Posted by SoonerCoug

So people could lose their possessions if they default on their loans?

I serious doubt this. We're talking about Latin America, largely, and from personal experience I will tell you that it's often more expensive to get a security interest in stuff down there than the PEF loans are worth. No, I suspect it's an uncollateralized non-recourse loan. Maybe you get excommunicated if you don't pay it back - I know the HOI has a list of "automatic excommunication things" and the one that weighs most heavily on my mind as the ward clerk is the "embezzlement of church funds" item.

Or maybe they tie it into temple recommends. Or maybe they do nothing.

But I'm pretty sure that they're not going into homes and stealing beds and televisions.

[Mormon Red Death]

Originally Posted by nikuman

I serious doubt this. We're talking about Latin America, largely, and from personal experience I will tell you that it's often more expensive to get a security interest in stuff down there than the PEF loans are worth. No, I suspect it's an uncollateralized non-recourse loan. Maybe you get excommunicated if you don't pay it back - I know the HOI has a list of "automatic excommunication things" and the one that weighs most heavily on my mind as the ward clerk is the "embezzlement of church funds" item.

Or maybe they tie it into temple recommends. Or maybe they do nothing.

But I'm pretty sure that they're not going into homes and stealing beds and televisions.

I seriously think they just ask that you contribute to the PEF indefinitely as your payment. I dont think there is any interest or repayment plans

[Mormon Red Death]

I stand corrected:





Questions and Answers about the Perpetual Education Fund

Questions and Answers


What is the Perpetual Education Fund, and what is its purpose?
Who may receive a Perpetual Education Fund loan?
How do participants get started?
How may the loans be used?
What are the loan terms and payment requirements?
Who manages the individual loans?
What about administrative costs?
How has the Perpetual Education Fund progressed?
Where is the Perpetual Education Fund currently available?
How can I help?
I want to apply for a loan. How do I start?

What is the Perpetual Education Fund, and what is its purpose?

At the April 2001 general conference, President Gordon B. Hinckley announced a "bold initiative" to help youth in developing areas "step out of the cycle of poverty." The Perpetual Education Fund:

* Is an inspired program to help ambitious, worthy young members of the Church receive training and education that lead to employment.
* Is modeled after the Perpetual Emigration Fund developed for the Church's early pioneers. As loans are repaid, the funds are re-circulated to provide opportunities for others.
* Provides student loans to young people in selected developing nations.
* Helps young people better provide for their families and grow in leadership and responsibility in the Church. It will strengthen individuals, families, and communities.

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Who may receive a Perpetual Education Fund loan?

Participants are ambitious young men or women who are:

* 18–30 years of age.
* Married or single.
* Worthy and active in the Church.
* Seeking education that leads to a better job or self-employment but lack the means to do so.
* Living, working, and attending school in countries approved for participation in the program.
* Enrolled in institute.
* Willing to work and use their own money to pay as much of the cost of education as possible.
* Committed to repay the loan so others may benefit.

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How do participants get started?

Young people must be enrolled in institute to participate. Interested institute students should talk to their institute director, who will help them:

* Complete a short career-training course.
* Choose a viable career.
* Select an appropriate school.
* Organize their finances.

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How may the loans be used?

Usually loans are used to pay for vocational or technical training completed in two years or less. Participants may qualify for up to four years, depending upon the course of study. Loans are typically used only for:

* Tuition.
* Books and fees.

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What are the loan terms and payment requirements?

Progress reports are required twice each year to verify effort and attendance at school, worthiness, activity in church and institute, and repayment integrity. Other requirements include the following:

* Soon after they start school, participants begin to make small monthly payments (about $5) to the bank.
* Larger payments are begun soon after graduation for a period of 2–8 years.
* A small amount of interest (3% plus an inflation factor) is charged to the loan.
* Participants strive to repay the loan as soon as possible to bless others who need help.
* In the event of a significant personal challenge, loan payments may be deferred or adjusted.

[Solon]

Originally Posted by Mormon Red Death

What are the loan terms and payment requirements?

Progress reports are required twice each year to verify effort and attendance at school, worthiness, activity in church and institute, and repayment integrity. Other requirements include the following:

* Soon after they start school, participants begin to make small monthly payments (about $5) to the bank.
* Larger payments are begun soon after graduation for a period of 2–8 years.
* A small amount of interest (3% plus an inflation factor) is charged to the loan.
* Participants strive to repay the loan as soon as possible to bless others who need help.
* In the event of a significant personal challenge, loan payments may be deferred or adjusted.

Interesting that there's an age cap (30). I guess that means you should have your career nailed down by that time (I'm screwed).

I like how the loan recipients make small monthly payments during their studies, maybe just to get in the habit of paying back. Seems like a good idea.

I have several friends who have tens of thousands of dollars in student loans but, since they're still in school, it hasn't hit home yet that they're going to have to pay them back someday (in theory, at least). Most of them have some pretty poor spending habits. It's going to be a rude awakening for some of them. Something like this might help them prepare.