Johnny (would) be good: - cougarguard.com — unofficial BYU Cougars / LDS sports, football, basketball forum and message board

BarbaraGordon · 01-20-2008, 04:11 PM

Hey Mike!
Isn't this what we've been trying to tell the GOP for about 9 months? This is from a Dem pundit at the Washington Post:

"If Democrats don't stay smart, tough-minded and realistic, we could blow it yet again. The first problem is our likely foe. Especially after his victory in South Carolina, Sen. John McCain has a plausible route to the GOP nomination, and he remains by far his party's best bet for holding on to the White House. The Republican field has been so preoccupied with appealing to the party's hard-core base that it seems that the eventual winner will have little appeal to the independent voters who can swing a general election. Even McCain started out by embracing the evangelical Christians he had once denounced. But as his seemingly dead campaign has been reborn, his initial efforts to pander to the religious right have been forgotten, and he is once again happily running as a "maverick." Though his nomination is hardly guaranteed, the Arizona senator would provide the GOP with a powerful mix of continuity and change -- continuity with the Bush administration on Iraq at a moment when it has become conventional wisdom that the "surge" is succeeding, and a sense of change and freshness from McCain's cheerfully frank past deviations from conservative orthodoxy."

Fair or not, by choosing to run either a polarizing female who represents everything we hate about the last twenty years of politics, or alternately a fairly inexperienced young biracial raised in Muslim Indonesia, the Dems are setting themselves up with serious liabilities. Whereas no one would have thought it possible a year ago, the GOPs actually have a solid chance to retain the White House. But they've got to go with McCain. Why the GOP establishment is so set against him is something I simply don't understand.

Now, I admit that I really don't think he can pull off the nomination. But then again as a Sooner fan, I'm used to supporting highly-publicized losing efforts on the national stage. kee hee!

The rest of the article discusses the struggles the Dems will face heading into the general election.

SoonerCoug · 01-20-2008, 06:34 PM

Babs=anti-Mormon bigot. I can't think of any other reason you'd oppose Romney (my 2nd cousin once removed).

Same goes for MikeWaters.

The only Mormons that didn't vote for Romney in Nevada were anarchists and anti-Mormon Mormons (sort of like anti-Nephi-Lehi-Nephis).

Venkman · 01-20-2008, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BarbaraGordon

Why the GOP establishment is so set against him is something I simply don't understand.

Because he's been giving the GOP establishment the finger for the last seven years.

Archaea · 01-20-2008, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoonerCoug

Babs=anti-Mormon bigot. I can't think of any other reason you'd oppose Romney (my 2nd cousin once removed).

Same goes for MikeWaters.

The only Mormons that didn't vote for Romney in Nevada were anarchists and anti-Mormon Mormons (sort of like anti-Nephi-Lehi-Nephis).

Or because she's smarter than you?

BarbaraGordon · 01-20-2008, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Venkman

Because he's been giving the GOP establishment the finger for the last seven years.

If he's going to give them the finger while they sell the party out to right-wing religious zealots, I'm okay with that. The fact that he's making a resurgence gives me hope that perhaps the party isn't quite as lost as I'd thought.

UtahDan · 01-20-2008, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BarbaraGordon

Why the GOP establishment is so set against him is something I simply don't understand.

It is because he is not been a conservative on almost anything but foreign policy. The Republican party is a conservative party.

By the way, I think this analysis is exactly right but will be surprised if Republicans go with McCain. As some one said, Republicans will likely go with someone who makes them feel good as they lose.

Detroitdad · 01-20-2008, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UtahDan

It is because he is not been a conservative on almost anything but foreign policy. The Republican party is a conservative party.

By the way, I think this analysis is exactly right but will be surprised if Republicans go with McCain. As some one said, Republicans will likely go with someone who makes them feel good as they lose.

What has he not been conservative about other than campaign finance? McCain is the only one of the Republicans I fear, because he has this reputation for not being conservative because he speaks his mind, which appeals to moderates and independents.

In reality he is quite conservative...he is just not a party above all else guy, which is why the Republican establishment hates him.

myboynoah · 01-20-2008, 10:00 PM

I just don't see McCain as that good of a candidate and question how good of a president he would be. He loves to kick Repubs in the nuts by crossing over and working with Dems on issues Repubs care about. We can get that from a Dem president and then kick his/her butt in the next election. We'd be stuck with McCain.

Besides, he probably can't resist Huckabee's manlove for him and will choose Huck as the VP candidate. Ugh.

UtahDan · 01-20-2008, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Detroitdad

What has he not been conservative about other than campaign finance? McCain is the only one of the Republicans I fear, because he has this reputation for not being conservative because he speaks his mind, which appeals to moderates and independents.

In reality he is quite conservative...he is just not a party above all else guy, which is why the Republican establishment hates him.

Tax cuts, abortion, gay rights, gun control, health care, the environment. This piece gets it about right:

http://www.slate.com/id/2139775/

BarbaraGordon · 01-20-2008, 10:46 PM

No, it's true that this is his Achilles Heel. He's not a true conservative.

But I'm tired of both parties treating these matters as a dichotomy. According to the GOP, either you're as conservative as the party ideal, or you're labeled a not-conservative, or worse, a liberal. Just because McCain is not as conservative as some of the other candidates does not mean he's not conservative. He's still a lot more conservative than Hillary or Obama. And the GOP would be wise to consider what's the worse case scenario: winning the White House with a candidate that's less conservative than they'd like, or losing the White House altogether, to an all-out liberal.

01-20-2008, 04:11 PM	#1
BarbaraGordon Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Gotham City Posts: 7,157	Johnny (would) be good: Hey Mike! Isn't this what we've been trying to tell the GOP for about 9 months? This is from a Dem pundit at the Washington Post: "If Democrats don't stay smart, tough-minded and realistic, we could blow it yet again. The first problem is our likely foe. Especially after his victory in South Carolina, Sen. John McCain has a plausible route to the GOP nomination, and he remains by far his party's best bet for holding on to the White House. The Republican field has been so preoccupied with appealing to the party's hard-core base that it seems that the eventual winner will have little appeal to the independent voters who can swing a general election. Even McCain started out by embracing the evangelical Christians he had once denounced. But as his seemingly dead campaign has been reborn, his initial efforts to pander to the religious right have been forgotten, and he is once again happily running as a "maverick." Though his nomination is hardly guaranteed, the Arizona senator would provide the GOP with a powerful mix of continuity and change -- continuity with the Bush administration on Iraq at a moment when it has become conventional wisdom that the "surge" is succeeding, and a sense of change and freshness from McCain's cheerfully frank past deviations from conservative orthodoxy." Fair or not, by choosing to run either a polarizing female who represents everything we hate about the last twenty years of politics, or alternately a fairly inexperienced young biracial raised in Muslim Indonesia, the Dems are setting themselves up with serious liabilities. Whereas no one would have thought it possible a year ago, the GOPs actually have a solid chance to retain the White House. But they've got to go with McCain. Why the GOP establishment is so set against him is something I simply don't understand. Now, I admit that I really don't think he can pull off the nomination. But then again as a Sooner fan, I'm used to supporting highly-publicized losing efforts on the national stage. kee hee! The rest of the article discusses the struggles the Dems will face heading into the general election.

01-20-2008, 10:00 PM	#8
myboynoah Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Memphis freakin' Tennessee!!!!! Posts: 4,530	I just don't see McCain as that good of a candidate and question how good of a president he would be. He loves to kick Repubs in the nuts by crossing over and working with Dems on issues Repubs care about. We can get that from a Dem president and then kick his/her butt in the next election. We'd be stuck with McCain. Besides, he probably can't resist Huckabee's manlove for him and will choose Huck as the VP candidate. Ugh. __________________ Give 'em Hell, Cougars!!! Religion rises inevitably from our apprehension of our own death. To give meaning to meaninglessness is the endless quest of all religion. When death becomes the center of our consciousness, then religion authentically begins. Of all religions that I know, the one that most vehemently and persuasively defies and denies the reality of death is the original Mormonism of the Prophet, Seer and Revelator, Joseph Smith.

01-20-2008, 06:34 PM	#2
SoonerCoug Formerly known as MudPhudCoug Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Land of desolation Posts: 2,548	Babs=anti-Mormon bigot. I can't think of any other reason you'd oppose Romney (my 2nd cousin once removed). Same goes for MikeWaters. The only Mormons that didn't vote for Romney in Nevada were anarchists and anti-Mormon Mormons (sort of like anti-Nephi-Lehi-Nephis).

01-20-2008, 10:46 PM	#10
BarbaraGordon Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Gotham City Posts: 7,157	No, it's true that this is his Achilles Heel. He's not a true conservative. But I'm tired of both parties treating these matters as a dichotomy. According to the GOP, either you're as conservative as the party ideal, or you're labeled a not-conservative, or worse, a liberal. Just because McCain is not as conservative as some of the other candidates does not mean he's not conservative. He's still a lot more conservative than Hillary or Obama. And the GOP would be wise to consider what's the worse case scenario: winning the White House with a candidate that's less conservative than they'd like, or losing the White House altogether, to an all-out liberal.