Americans views of Mormons Gallup poll - Page 6 - cougarguard.com — unofficial BYU Cougars / LDS sports, football, basketball forum and message board

SeattleUte · 03-04-2007, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by il Padrino Ute

Just what makes you doubt that he is a true believer?

I know a lot of guys like him.

tooblue · 03-04-2007, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

I know a lot of guys like him.

But you don't know him

Jeff Lebowski · 03-04-2007, 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

You may have a point except I don't "loath" them.

Well, if I have misunderstood you then I apologize. Your post reminded me of some earlier posts you made where you seemed to have ripped on the LDS intellectual community. And I appreciate the kind comments. Perhaps I will look you up in Seattle someday.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

But there are many aspects of liberals whether or not Mormon that I dislike...

Aha... I think the problem we have in our communication here is one of semantics. I consider a "mormon liberal" and a "political liberal" to be two different animals. They may overlap, but they don't have to.

hyrum · 03-04-2007, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jay santos

The thing that stuck out at me was the effect of Mitt Romney. 6% identified him as their first association with the church and those had a favorable view of the church. With data like that, it probably makes sense for the church to pump $100M into Romney's presidency for no other good than Mormon PR. Though of course something like that would backfire on you.

The LDS Church would immediately lose its non-profit status. Quite costly.

Jeff Lebowski · 03-04-2007, 08:58 PM

This has been a fascinating thread. Did ETB cause LDS to be right-wingers or was he simply a manifestation of the conservative nature of the LDS community? Classic chicken vs. egg scenario, eh? I tend to believe (as several others have expressed) that the truth is somewhere in the middle. Given the rural, western makeup of the church and the political mindset of middle america in the 50's, ETB's message certainly resonated with the rank and file members. And yet, his politics were extreme and no LDS leader in modern times has been anywhere near as political as he was. Not by a mile. Yes, he mellowed in his later years (which is faith-promoting, by the way) but this is a man who would routinely stand up in general conference and give blatantly political talks, including a repeated warning that the civil rights movement was a communist plot. What he did was legitimize extreme political viewpoints in the church. While most members don't walk around quoting him today, there is still a substantial number that do.

Believe it or not, I was raised in a John Birch Society home. I got a belly full of right-wing extremism growing up. I used to resent my mother for scaring the hell out of us kids with stories of evil communists in our midsts, but I tend to be more forgiving as I come to understand how common this was during that period of time. She was a product of her generation.

hyrum · 03-04-2007, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cali Coug

Americans don't want to vote for a Mormon because they don't know what that means just yet. Many think it means the guy they saw on Newsweek's cover with 36 wives, many of whom were his nieces. Once they learn more, Romney's largest contribution may, assuming he doesn't win, be to make Mormonism a non-issue for the next Mormon candidate by informing the masses about what the religion actually is.

You make it sound as if everyone will react favorably to the "truth" about the church. Maybe that is true if they learn from the white-washed missionary manuals and TBM members. It wasn't the true in my case when I also sought information from unbiased sources.

Cali Coug · 03-04-2007, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hyrum

You make it sound as if everyone will react favorably to the "truth" about the church. Maybe that is true if they learn from the white-washed missionary manuals and TBM members. It wasn't the true in my case when I also sought information from unbiased sources.

No, not at all. Many will react negatively. But by and large, the Romney campaign could wind up eliminating many of the radical perceptions that exist about Mormons. Millions still believe Mormons are polygamists or some devil worshipping clan in Utah. Following Romney's campaign, they may not like Mormons anymore than they do today, but at least many will realize that Mormons are not an off-the-wall cult like they are portrayed.

Cali Coug · 03-04-2007, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

Precisely my point. Nobody respects Bush anymore. You won't see anyone trying to ge ino his skin this election as Bush Sr. did Reagan for example.

A lot of people still respect Bush (just nobody I hang out with

). If you want to be elected president of the United States, you had better be religious in today's environment. Take a look at any poll you want to that has asked that question. Would Americans vote for an atheist or someone who states they don't have much faith? The polls universally say they would not. Americans WOULD vote for someone who brings up religion with regularity, as they have done MANY times in the nation's history (GWB being the most recent).

Romney's "religiousness" is only a factor right now because few know much about his religion. He doesn't raise the issue much on his own, in fact, he tries to avoid the issue as much as possible (noting that there should be "no religious qualifications for office"). But he CANNOT win the primary unless he convinces people he believes in Christ. I think it is reprehensible that such is the case, but I have no doubt that it is true. So he will tell people his particular brand of belief isn't important while telling them that his more broadly acceptable beliefs (like a belief in Christ) are fundamental to his life.

myboynoah · 03-05-2007, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cali Coug

No, not at all. Many will react negatively. But by and large, the Romney campaign could wind up eliminating many of the radical perceptions that exist about Mormons. Millions still believe Mormons are polygamists or some devil worshipping clan in Utah. Following Romney's campaign, they may not like Mormons anymore than they do today, but at least many will realize that Mormons are not an off-the-wall cult like they are portrayed.

I agree. When I got married, by nonmember FiL made me promise that I would not take another wife. He was also surprised when he met my parents that they weren't dressed up and act like Colorado City polygamists ("Wow, they're just like normal people."). A lot of ignorance out there and Romney's candidacy helps to clear those things up and bring Mormonism further into the mainstream of American life. Sure, some stuff that gets exposed will be strange, but strange quickly becomes oddly interesting, and maybe even quaint upon exposure. The shock value dissipates.

I'm not saying everyone will think favorably of Mormons, I just think they will respond less negatively. The great equalizer for all of us is first hand experience. Romney's candidacy gives more Americans a chance for that.

Detroitdad · 03-05-2007, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by myboynoah

I agree. When I got married, by nonmember FiL made me promise that I would not take another wife. He was also surprised when he met my parents that they weren't dressed up and act like Colorado City polygamists ("Wow, they're just like normal people."). A lot of ignorance out there and Romney's candidacy helps to clear those things up and bring Mormonism further into the mainstream of American life. Sure, some stuff that gets exposed will be strange, but strange quickly becomes oddly interesting, and maybe even quaint upon exposure. The shock value dissipates.

I'm not saying everyone will think favorably of Mormons, I just think they will respond less negatively. The great equalizer for all of us is first hand experience. Romney's candidacy gives more Americans a chance for that.

I agree with the sentiments of this in principle. However, in the poll I see that in the West the negatives on Mormons are 47%. It strains credulity to believe that most Westerners are not at least somewhat familiar with Mormons. We make up 5% of Westerners as it is.

So I see stats that do not fit what I would have thought to be the case. Do you have any ideas why this would be the case?

03-04-2007, 08:58 PM	#55
Jeff Lebowski Charon Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: In the heart of darkness (Provo) Posts: 9,564	This has been a fascinating thread. Did ETB cause LDS to be right-wingers or was he simply a manifestation of the conservative nature of the LDS community? Classic chicken vs. egg scenario, eh? I tend to believe (as several others have expressed) that the truth is somewhere in the middle. Given the rural, western makeup of the church and the political mindset of middle america in the 50's, ETB's message certainly resonated with the rank and file members. And yet, his politics were extreme and no LDS leader in modern times has been anywhere near as political as he was. Not by a mile. Yes, he mellowed in his later years (which is faith-promoting, by the way) but this is a man who would routinely stand up in general conference and give blatantly political talks, including a repeated warning that the civil rights movement was a communist plot. What he did was legitimize extreme political viewpoints in the church. While most members don't walk around quoting him today, there is still a substantial number that do. Believe it or not, I was raised in a John Birch Society home. I got a belly full of right-wing extremism growing up. I used to resent my mother for scaring the hell out of us kids with stories of evil communists in our midsts, but I tend to be more forgiving as I come to understand how common this was during that period of time. She was a product of her generation. __________________ "... the arc of the universe is long but it bends toward justice." Martin Luther King, Jr.