A Friends of Scouting Rant

[BigFatMeanie]

I just finished my assigned Friends of Scouting duty and it was one of the most distasteful things I've ever had to do as a church member. Here are my problems with the Friends of Scouting program as it is implemented in the Great Salt Lake Council (Friends of Scouting is implemented on a council-by-council basis and as such can be implemented differently in different locations):

In the Great Salt Lake Council, the Friends of Scouting program is largely conducted by the LDS church. Many stakes/wards make it a priesthood assignment and a quick search of LDS.org makes it evident that some General Authories believe it is a priesthood assignment. If making a priesthood assignment for priesthood holders to go door-to-door soliciting money for a non-priesthood organization isn't unrighteous dominion then I don't know what ever could be considered unrighteous dominion.

Another major problem with asking priesthood holders to do Friends of Scouting is the fact that the money goes directly to the Great Salt Lake Council. Thus, you have priesthood leaders with priesthood keys asking priesthood holders to solicit donations for an external organization that has no priesthood keys or accountability. There is no priesthood oversight for funds that are being collected via priesthood authority. That is wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong. Doesn't the church take great pains in its aid/relief effort to not simply give large chunks of money to external organizations? Instead they purchase supplies and arrange for external organizations to ship or distribute them. So why is Friends of Scouting handled differently?

That fact that I think this is wrong puts me in between a rock and a hard place: how do I sustain my leaders when I believe that unrighteous dominion is occurring? If I say "No bishop, I will not do this assignment you are giving me" then am I guilty of not sustaining my leaders? If Friends of Scouting is being intertwined with the priesthood at a General Authority level (I believe, but don't know for sure, that this is the case), am I guilty of "evil-speaking of the Lord's annointed" if I criticize things?

[MikeWaters]

were you called and set apart? or were you given a verbal assignment?

[BigFatMeanie]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

were you called and set apart? or were you given a verbal assignment?

I was given a verbal assignment. Of course, the bishop (who gave the assignment to the second counselor who broke up the assignment and gave me a piece of it) was called and set apart. The Stake President (who gave the assignment to each bishop in the ward) was called and set apart.

I'm not sure how the stake presidency got the assignment but obviously there is some link at some level between the Great Salt Lake Council and the priesthood channels of the church.

[hyrum]

Originally Posted by BigFatMeanie

That fact that I think this is wrong puts me in between a rock and a hard place: how do I sustain my leaders when I believe that unrighteous dominion is occurring? If I say "No bishop, I will not do this assignment you are giving me" then am I guilty of not sustaining my leaders? If Friends of Scouting is being intertwined with the priesthood at a General Authority level (I believe, but don't know for sure, that this is the case), am I guilty of "evil-speaking of the Lord's annointed" if I criticize things?

So you are being asked to do something that is against your principles and you are worried about offending your leaders? Just say no. No sense in "sustaining your leaders" if it means compromising your principles.

[BigFatMeanie]

Originally Posted by hyrum

So you are being asked to do something that is against your principles and you are worried about offending your leaders? Just say no. No sense in "sustaining your leaders" if it means compromising your principles.

Not so much worried about offending my leaders. It's more of wondering what the principle of "sustaining my leaders" really means. Because "sustaining my leaders" is also a principle, this instance boils down to a case of conflicting principles.

Obviously there is no specific formula or guideline to one can follow when faced with a conflict of principles. I generally go with my gut in those situations. In this instance, my gut said "no" but I didn't nut up and tell the Bishop's counselor no. That's part of what bothers me about this situation - my own lack of guts.

Another thing that bothers me is the fact that the "conflict of principles" situation arose in the first place. I'm left to wonder if the stake president/bishop/bishop's counselor, etc. didn't see anything wrong with the way FOS was implemented or if they too felt something was wrong about it but they were too chicken like me to "just say no".

[Eddie R.]

When I first participated in Friends of Scouting I felt much like you did. I support scouting enough with everything else I'm doing, now you want me to go beg from my neighbors too?

I learned a little more about it, which made it less distasteful for me.

Each charter organization benefits from the council and district, and it takes money to run those organizations.

A portion of Friends of Scouting goes towards purchasing camps. The Great SL Council just purchased the land in the Uintas that they've been leasing for years (south fork of the Bear?). Now they can develop the camps a little more than before and do some things the forest service wouldn't allow. Troops get a discount when they go to a council camp. Troops from outside the council pay more.

A portion goes towards liability insurance. Pays for when a scout does something like burn down half the mountainside and the council is responsible or a kid gets lost and they are paying search and rescue, etc.

A portion goes for training for district roundtables and support.

Also - they are using Friends of Scouting to supplement money lost by United Way reducing the amount they give scouting each.

Anyway, I felt a little bit better about the program and contributing when put in those terms.

[bluegoose]

Originally Posted by Eddie R.

When I first participated in Friends of Scouting I felt much like you did. I support scouting enough with everything else I'm doing, now you want me to go beg from my neighbors too?

I learned a little more about it, which made it less distasteful for me.

Each charter organization benefits from the council and district, and it takes money to run those organizations.

A portion of Friends of Scouting goes towards purchasing camps. The Great SL Council just purchased the land in the Uintas that they've been leasing for years (south fork of the Bear?). Now they can develop the camps a little more than before and do some things the forest service wouldn't allow. Troops get a discount when they go to a council camp. Troops from outside the council pay more.

A portion goes towards liability insurance. Pays for when a scout does something like burn down half the mountainside and the council is responsible or a kid gets lost and they are paying search and rescue, etc.

A portion goes for training for district roundtables and support.

Also - they are using Friends of Scouting to supplement money lost by United Way reducing the amount they give scouting each.

Anyway, I felt a little bit better about the program and contributing when put in those terms.

Thats interesting stuff Eddie. I've always reluctantly donated to the FOS drive, but never really knew where it went. Praise Jesus that I've never been asked to head up the drive (Quick! Find me some wood to knock on!)

What did you mean with that little bit about the United Way? It didn't come off very clearly, as it sounds like you are saying that the FOS funds go to cover money that the United Way has lost. That can't be right.

Are families of the boys ever responsible for assisting with monies to pay for search and rescue, damaged forest service property, fires, etc?

[SteelBlue]

Originally Posted by bluegoose

What did you mean with that little bit about the United Way? It didn't come off very clearly, as it sounds like you are saying that the FOS funds go to cover money that the United Way has lost. That can't be right.

I think he meant that the United Way has severely scaled back their donations to the BSA because of the BSA's position on gays in scouting. At one time they were one of if not the biggest contributors to scouting nationally.

[Eddie R.]

Originally Posted by SteelBlue

I think he meant that the United Way has severely scaled back their donations to the BSA because of the BSA's position on gays in scouting. At one time they were one of if not the biggest contributors to scouting nationally.

That is exactly it. With the flap regarding non-gay scout leaders, etc. the United Way has severely cut back how much they give to scouting each year.

I don't remember the exact numbers, but it is a small percentage of what they used to give - like it used to be in the hundreds of thousands and now it is around $25K and goes down a little more each year.

I don't know how much BSA pays when someone is lost (particularly if it is a non-scout age kid just there with daddy like a couple of years ago) or when there is a fire, but I know some of it comes from BSA. The Great SL Council hasn't allowed campfires at their camps the past couple of years because they are still paying for that fire in the Uintas (I don't know if it is because they are literally paying or the insurance company required it).

Another thing I missed, the Council sometimes picks up some nice gadgets that benefit individual troops. GSL Counsil picked up some trackers that troops can check out when going backpacking. Same technology as they use to track falcons and nice to know you can take a trip and not lose any kids.

[BigFatMeanie]

Originally Posted by Eddie R.

That is exactly it. With the flap regarding non-gay scout leaders, etc. the United Way has severely cut back how much they give to scouting each year.

I don't remember the exact numbers, but it is a small percentage of what they used to give - like it used to be in the hundreds of thousands and now it is around $25K and goes down a little more each year.

I don't know how much BSA pays when someone is lost (particularly if it is a non-scout age kid just there with daddy like a couple of years ago) or when there is a fire, but I know some of it comes from BSA. The Great SL Council hasn't allowed campfires at their camps the past couple of years because they are still paying for that fire in the Uintas (I don't know if it is because they are literally paying or the insurance company required it).

Another thing I missed, the Council sometimes picks up some nice gadgets that benefit individual troops. GSL Counsil picked up some trackers that troops can check out when going backpacking. Same technology as they use to track falcons and nice to know you can take a trip and not lose any kids.

I have no problem with the Scouts having fundraisers. I'm sure there are many good and noble things they do with the funds. My problem is with the implementation of this particular fundraiser - at least it's implementation in the GSL Council (other councils implement Friends of Scouting in completely different ways).

High Council Representative is called by Priesthood to serve on some district or area scouting board. The High Council Rep brings the Friends of Scouting assignment back to the Stake. The Stake Priesident the propagates the assignment through Priesthood channels to the Bishop. The Bishop then propogates the assignment through Priesthood channels to a counselor or to someone in the YM presidency who may in turn propagate it to others. The funds are collected and returned to the Bishopric who returns them up the line to the Stake Presidency/High Council who returns them up the line and so forth. Each ward isn't sending its funds directly to the BSA - it's being propagated back up through Priesthood channels.

It's possible to do all kinds of strained hair splitting along the lines of " I'm not calling you and setting you apart but I am asking you do to this assignment but it's not a Priesthood even though I am your Priesthood leader". That line of thinking bothers me a lot. It's similar to the hair splitting that people do with "He's speaking as a prophet", "Oops, now he's speaking as a man", "Whoa, he just started speaking as a prophet again". The assignment is either a Priesthood assignment or it's not. If it's not a Priesthood assignment it shouldn't be coming through Priesthood channels. If it is, then I question why we have a Priesthood assignment to raise funds with no Priesthood accountability over the disbursement of those funds.

I suppose if you abstract the situation, I have a problem with the coupling of the church and Scouting in general, but that is a topic for another day. I'm sure Friends of Scouting is all for a good cause; however, the lines in this situation are just too blurry for my taste.

Cheers,

BFM