General questions for the board,

[stonewallperry]

Originally Posted by shobeewan

I have read quite a bit of information on this board that I find very disturbing coming from members of the church. I haven't been on the board long enough to learn everyone's personality and stance on things but I still find it interesting that people who are members or claim to be members will outright critisize the leadership of the church. People wanting explanations and reasons why the church does or has done certain things in the past, having their lists of things that the church needs to change, and outright anger that the leadership of the church would dare make a statement against endorsing one of the most heinous sins committed by the people on this earth.

I have a few questions
1- Who is the leader of this church? If you answer anyone but Jesus Christ why are you a member of the church? This is not President Hinkley's church, or Joseph's church, or even Brigham's church. The Lord is at the head and he is leading us in the direction we need to go. Who are we to question the Lord?

2- Is President Hinkley a Prophet? Once again if he isn't why are you a member of the church? Now the "blindly following" and "elevating leadership to godhood level" people are already perking up and rebutting this, but you raise your hand to sustain President Hinkley as a Prophet multiple times a year, why would you do this if you don't believe he is? As a prophet he is the mortal/ physical leader of the church here on the earth. Not every word that comes from his mouth is scripture or a direct commandment, but by ignoring his counsel and teachings you are ignoring the Lord. President Hinkley has been given keys by the Lord to set policy, and receive revelation for the entire church. If you doubt this once again why are you a member? Every time we receive a new leader of the church I pray about whether he is a prophet, I receive a positive answer and that is good enough for me.

3- Why do you feel that you have the right to ask or demand explanations or policy from the Lord? If the leader of the church is a prophet who speaks for the Lord with policies and statements regarding the position or beliefs of the church what gives you the right to question the right of the Lord to say those things? If you want to blow them off as the diluded ramblings of an old man who is out of touch that is fine, but you also sustain that rambling old man as a mouthpiece of the Lord.

I have just been troubled after reading some of the things that have been said on this board for the past little while. If you question and don't follow the Prophet's council on little issues, how are you going to follow his council on big issues? You can justify why you won't follow the Prophet on this issue or that, but if you follow the Prophet you will be going in the right direction. The Lord is not going to allow him to lead us astray. I don't think it will be very comfortable sitting in front of the Lord and telling him that the reason I didn't follow his Prophet's council was because "it wasn't an official commandment" or "I am just smarter and knew better than the Prophet what I should do." or my favorite "there wasn't a temple recommend question regarding that point."

I am sure I will be blasted for this as a blind follower. No I don't believe President Hinkley is a perfect man. I do believe he is a Prophet who speaks for the Lord, so when he speaks for the Church we need to give heed and follow his teachings. It all comes down to my first two questions, if the answer to either one is no, you are in the wrong church.

Sorry for the rambling, but had to get it off my chest.

Your comments are completely correct...thanks for putting into words all that I've been thinking the past few days. Now, you're going to be called all kinds of names as the righteous often are.

[MikeWaters]

I wonder if more members left the church as a result of the 1978 declaration than left due to the blacks being denied the priesthood?

My point being that those who are so invested in the status quo have a hard time letting go, and they are often the mullah-type.

[stonewallperry]

Originally Posted by RockyBalboa

I think the sharing of ideas and discussions is a good one as well. I've never been against that and never will be. However, when a member of the church openly criticizes the LITERAL mouthpiece on earth for Jesus Christ, it is simply them fulfilling prophecy as far as I'm concerned. It is incumbent upon them REGARDLESS of political belief to support Jesus Christ. The prophet doesn't make a declaration based on personal belief, and that might be news to some.

In hindsights perhaps my comments were a bit harsh, seeing as I fall on a completely different side of faith and belief as Robin and NS do, but they carry a haughty smugness in their mocking tone of those who do believe and believe strongly and for that I will always stand against and speak out against and make aboslutely zero apologies for it. It's too bad more don't have the guts to do the same.

Well stated...I'll stand against it too brother!

[stonewallperry]

Originally Posted by Faith

Rocky, I feel like you are making some assumptions. Do you really think that all people who disagree with the LDS prophet don't care what Jesus Christ thinks? Could these people possibly be feeling llike thay are receiving revelation from the Holy Ghost that is contradictory to the prophet?

Remember, most people who are LDS have been taught to value personal revelation and communication with God through the Holy Ghost. As a missionary, I remember trying to specifically help investigators recognize and identify the spirit. It is ultimately through our communication with the Holy Ghost that we gain our testimonies about anything in the gospel, including our testimonies about the prophet being called of God.

Is it possible for the Holy Ghost to tell us something contradictory from the prophet? (If Nephi hadn't listened to the Holy Ghost, he would NEVER had killed Laban in the BofM, because murdering is clearly taught by the prophets to be against God's will.) If one cannot count on the Holy Ghost to know truth, then the entire foundation of personal knowledge of the gospel is unstable. I believe that I am ultimately accountable to God for acting for or against what I feel that I am being told by the Holy Ghost, as I actively seek his guidance.

What does one do when one really feels that the Holy Ghost is telling them something contrary to the Prophet's words? Do they ignore the promptings, keep praying, repenting, and hoping that Satan is trying to deceive them? What if they still feel that the Holy Ghost is telling them somethig contrary to the prophet's words? Do they use reason and evaluate how important of an issue it is for them to even wrestle with? Do they wonder if God is testing their obedience to a prophet of God? I personally don't believe that God would give such a ridiculous test. When the early saints practiced polygamy, I don't think that they could have without personal peace given from the Holy Ghost. I cannot live without peace in my heart, and I do not have peace in my heart when I feel that I am going against the promptings of the holy ghost.

When Nephi was told to kill Laban, it was clearly to fulfill the Lord's purposes. Could you give an example of when the Spirit has told you to disobey the commandments and which of the Lord's purposes was beeing met?

[ute4ever]

Originally Posted by JohnnyLingo

It's interesting that I can post a few verses from the Book of Mormon and elicit a derisive and mocking response from this crowd.

Another profound contribution from the ninja as usual. What a deep analysis of the subject.

[JohnnyLingo]

How hypocritical of you to say I don't contribute to the discussion while not contributing anything yourself.

Go to hell.

[Mormon Red Death]

Originally Posted by JohnnyLingo

How hypocritical of you to say I don't contribute to the discussion while not contributing anything yourself.

Go to hell.

So are you saying he is damned because he didn't contribute anything to the discussion?

[Cali Coug]

Originally Posted by JohnnyLingo

How hypocritical of you to say I don't contribute to the discussion while not contributing anything yourself.

Go to hell.

Did BRM have a quote about people going to hell if they don't contribute to cougarguard that I am unaware of?

Once again firmly establishing yourself as a member of the "righteous" camp.