Disappointed with Nelson's talk - Page 5 - cougarguard.com — unofficial BYU Cougars / LDS sports, football, basketball forum and message board

jay santos · 10-08-2008, 11:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex

1. Whoa, wait a minute. Where in that scripture does it say "this only applies to the Celestial Kingdom"?

2. Nelson did share it, but you're not accepting it.

Here we have God saying "I don't honor earthly connections" and that apparently means nothing to you. We have Jesus speaking of a "great gulf fixed," as does Nephi. What does that mean to you?

I also think you're reading too much into one sentence. I don't think Nelson was drawing an absolute on all contact whatsoever--who the hell knows what exactly existence is like in the afterlife? His point is, a true reunion--a reuniting and reconstitution of the marital relationship which existed here on earth--is not possible and will not happen.

Even if God let's them sneak in a hug and a phone call, it won't last. Not until they are bound by a contract with eternal efficacy. In the end, the doctrine is true that they will be separate.

If I'm drawing too much from his one sentence, then he's drawing too much from the one sentence from a grieving loved one.

creekster · 10-08-2008, 11:08 PM

This is hard to understand, to be honest, for me. IF everyone is the same as here, and we have an infinite amount of time, then why couldn't we find each other again? My guess (and it is only a guess) is that God is trying to tell us something about temple marriage. That in the next life, the purpose of marriage can be realized and its fulfillment can only happen through the sealing power (I am tlaking about post-resurrection here).

Many of the things that seem important here will not be important at all in the next life. When you have all eternity to do something (be with someone, look in their eyes, etc.) how interesting or exciting will it be? Perhaps the only meaningful connection is being with one with the benefits of spouses who are creators and that is only for those who are sealed. Hanging around in the same general vicinity of your spouse, without the sealing bond, will not be significant or meaningful.

CardiacCoug · 10-08-2008, 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex

...who the hell knows what exactly existence is like in the afterlife?

Great point, Tex. I agree completely.

Tex · 10-08-2008, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jay santos

If I'm drawing too much from his one sentence, then he's drawing too much from the one sentence from a grieving loved one.

I think he was trying to teach a larger principle, and the obituary was just an illustration. You're treating the illustration as if it were the principle.

Quote:

Originally Posted by creekster

This is hard to understand, to be honest, for me. IF everyone is the same as here, and we have an infinite amount of time, then why couldn't we find each other again? My guess (and it is only a guess) is that God is trying to tell us something about temple marriage. That in the next life, the purpose of marriage can be realized and its fulfillment can only happen through the sealing power (I am tlaking about post-resurrection here).

Many of the things that seem important here will not be important at all in the next life. When you have all eternity to do something (be with someone, look in their eyes, etc.) how interesting or exciting will it be? Perhaps the only meaningful connection is being with one with the benefits of spouses who are creators and that is only for those who are sealed. Hanging around in the same general vicinity of your spouse, without the sealing bond, will not be significant or meaningful.

Those are good thoughts, creekster.

Keep in mind, too, we have Peter (1 Peter 3) and Joseph F. Smith (D&C 138) both indicating that it was not until the resurrection of Jesus that the gospel was taught in spirit prison, some of them (apparently) waiting since the days of Noah! That suggests a separation.

I'm sure Arch or someone will insist this is just a rhetorical device to help our finite minds understand the afterlife. Whatever the case, it does seem that there are lines drawn.

MikeWaters · 10-08-2008, 11:29 PM

Hasn't Elder Nelson had a spouse die? Him having been through that experience, I have a hard time imagining him saying this to someone's face who has had a parent die.

He means it as a construct, but I'm not sure it was the best away to approach it. Of course he believes the Mormon church is the only path to salvation, and he is one of the only humans on earth to be able to interpret what that is for everyone else.

FMCoug · 10-08-2008, 11:34 PM

LOL. This is what I love about CG, especially this forum. Elder Nelson expounding on settled doctrine becomes "kicking people while they're down".

You guys act like he's advocating pointing this out to the newly widowed.

jay santos · 10-08-2008, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FMCoug

LOL. This is what I love about CG, especially this forum. Elder Nelson expounding on settled doctrine becomes "kicking people while they're down".

You guys act like he's advocating pointing this out to the newly widowed.

No new widows were watching conference? Were they all at the USC game?

FMCoug · 10-08-2008, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jay santos

No new widows were watching conference? Were they all at the USC game?

Let's not talk about the Word of Wisdom either then. You might offend some smokers!

Or baptism being a requirement for salvation. Hindus might be watching!

Etc ...

jay santos · 10-08-2008, 11:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FMCoug

You guys act like he's advocating pointing this out to the newly widowed.

...

creekster · 10-08-2008, 11:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jay santos

No new widows were watching conference? Were they all at the USC game?

Triplet is a widow?

10-08-2008, 11:08 PM	#42
creekster Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: the far corner of my mind Posts: 8,711	This is hard to understand, to be honest, for me. IF everyone is the same as here, and we have an infinite amount of time, then why couldn't we find each other again? My guess (and it is only a guess) is that God is trying to tell us something about temple marriage. That in the next life, the purpose of marriage can be realized and its fulfillment can only happen through the sealing power (I am tlaking about post-resurrection here). Many of the things that seem important here will not be important at all in the next life. When you have all eternity to do something (be with someone, look in their eyes, etc.) how interesting or exciting will it be? Perhaps the only meaningful connection is being with one with the benefits of spouses who are creators and that is only for those who are sealed. Hanging around in the same general vicinity of your spouse, without the sealing bond, will not be significant or meaningful. __________________ Sorry for th e tpyos.

10-08-2008, 11:34 PM	#46
FMCoug Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kaysville, UT Posts: 3,151	LOL. This is what I love about CG, especially this forum. Elder Nelson expounding on settled doctrine becomes "kicking people while they're down". You guys act like he's advocating pointing this out to the newly widowed. __________________ Still fat ...

10-08-2008, 11:29 PM	#45
MikeWaters Demiurge Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 36,365	Hasn't Elder Nelson had a spouse die? Him having been through that experience, I have a hard time imagining him saying this to someone's face who has had a parent die. He means it as a construct, but I'm not sure it was the best away to approach it. Of course he believes the Mormon church is the only path to salvation, and he is one of the only humans on earth to be able to interpret what that is for everyone else.