McCain has doubled up Romney in early CA returns

[Jeff Lebowski]

Originally Posted by Tex

Hmmm, divisive isn't necessarily bad if you don't want anything to get done. Were Hillary president, I would want as little accomplished by the federal gov't as possible.

Unlike some, I don't think the divisive political culture in today's America is the most serious problem we face.

I like gridlock. I desperately wish we had more of it in the Utah state legislature.

[Archaea]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

I wouldn't waste my time arguing with a disgruntled Romney supporter who picks up his ball and walks away saying he's now for Hillary. That's just ludicrous. Vote for Hillary if you like socialism. She'd support a Constitutional amendment guaranteeing government sponsored child care for everyone and she's proud of it. She's not Bill, she's Teddy.

Nobody sane who is not a socialist votes for Hillary. However, the energy and money will be missing.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski

Interesting.

So when you were in high school and the prettiest girl in the school turned you down when you asked her to the homecoming dance, did you turn around and ask the ugliest girl just to spite her?

No, but I wouldn't go ask my old girlfriend who cheated on me, either.

How would like to go out to UCLA, lay prostrate on your face before Ben Olson, and beg him to return to BYU?

[Jeff Lebowski]

Originally Posted by Tex

No, but I wouldn't go ask my old girlfriend who cheated on me, either.

How would like to go out to UCLA, lay prostrate on your face before Ben Olson, and beg him to return to BYU?

I like my analogy better.

[minn_stat]

Originally Posted by BarbaraGordon

I disagree. She is the single most polarizing figure in American politics. We don't need another divisive figure.

In addition, she has proven through the primary process that she does not respond well to criticism and she can't admit when she's wrong. We already have a president with those two flaws. It hasn't been pretty.

And while his voting record is liberal, Obama's proposals themselves are not any more liberal than Hillary's, and some of them are less so.

She is highly polarizing, but that polarization will help to blunt or even defeat some of her more obnoxious proposals, and would likely breathe new life into a damaged republican party, much the way Jimmy Carter's presidency opened the door for the ascendency of Reagan and the conservative movement.

Obama, given his charisma and likeability, is more likely to usher in a ten or twenty year liberal period for the U.S. I think recovering from 4 yrs of fairly bad policy is much easier than undoing the long-term damage Obama might wreak on our economy.

As to their proposals, I believe Hillary is more likely to moderate her stances and proposals come the general election and in her presidency. For example, I believe she'll actually be reluctant to pull troops out of Iraq very quickly - I think she has some understanding of the foolishness of such a policy, and will find reasons to delay this action, pulling fewer troops out on a more prolonged timetable. Obama, I'm not so sure.

Her flaws are real and worrisome, and I'll admit they trouble me. I think she will be the most personally flawed of any president in my memory - and my memory includes Richard Nixon (yes, I'm getting old).

[minn_stat]

Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski

Interesting.

So when you were in high school and the prettiest girl in the school turned you down when you asked her to the homecoming dance, did you turn around and ask the ugliest girl just to spite her?

How did you know about my high school days? Todd, is that you?

[MikeWaters]

So minn_stat, fundamentally, you don't think "the people are always correct."

In other words, people could choose a 20 year path to socialism, against their own interests? You think Obama's charisma is a greater power than the GOP message (whatever that is).

[BarbaraGordon]

Originally Posted by minn_stat

She is highly polarizing, but that polarization will help to blunt or even defeat some of her more obnoxious proposals, and would likely breathe new life into a damaged republican party, much the way Jimmy Carter's presidency opened the door for the ascendency of Reagan and the conservative movement.

I understand now. You'd rather have a bad Democratic presidency and have it over in four years, with no faits accomplis, than risk somebody that the people might actually like and support and re-elect.

There's some logic to that. I do hope the GOP gets its act together. It's becoming clear that even Republicans aren't happy with the current incarnation of the party.

[minn_stat]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

I wouldn't waste my time arguing with a disgruntled Romney supporter who picks up his ball and walks away saying he's now for Hillary. That's just ludicrous. Vote for Hillary if you like socialism. She'd support a Constitutional amendment guaranteeing government sponsored child care for everyone and she's proud of it. She's not Bill, she's Teddy.

Perhaps I'm slightly disgruntled. But to be candid, being so active gives me a certain peacefulness. I did what I could for something I believed in. It didn't go my way. I don't think the world is going to collapse tomorrow because it didn't. What more can you do for your cause? But I can move forward feeling that I stood for what I believed in, that I did my part. And I firmly believe that there is a God who is in control of the larger issues that matter, and I trust in Him.

I want to do what is best for my family and the country - first and foremost in the long term, but also for the short term. I believe I've been fairly rational in coming to my positions, and I'm not set in them. Have my emotions played a role in this decision? Certainly. Might I change my positions? It wouldn't surprise me in the least - there is a lot more I will be learning about candidates over the next 8 months.

I have not ruled out voting for McCain, as I indicated. He is not some evil monster because he beat the person I wanted. He's got his strengths, and he's got some baggage that make me hesitate about supporting him.

[MikeWaters]

And I firmly believe that there is a God who is in control of the larger issues that matter,

the idea that God was in control during the Holcaust, WWI, WWII and Rwanda, etc. is hard to fathom.

I think the more likely explanation is that Man was in control.