Disappointed with Nelson's talk - Page 3 - cougarguard.com — unofficial BYU Cougars / LDS sports, football, basketball forum and message board

Archaea · 10-08-2008, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indy Coug

What a ridiculous characterization. I'm not kicking anybody. I don't make the rules. However, I do believe that Elder Nelson has a better fix on what the rules are than you or I do for this particular matter.

Do I rejoice in the concept that people cannot be united eternally without being sealed and/or failing to live up to their covenants? No. In fact, I have close family members I worry about because of this.

Heck, I worry about my own marriage and whether or not I'm sufficiently keeping up my end of the bargain.

I am not surprised by Elder Nelson's talk and we shall continue to hear more of the same. In fact, I doubt I shall ever live to see the day when a GA proclaims anything but exclusivity for exaltation. That doesn't mean there are in the eternities exceptions or other methodologies for salvation and exaltation, but only you won't find them preached by leadership.

It was a weird way of approaching the topic, but not too surprising.

Indy Coug · 10-08-2008, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Archaea

I am not surprised by Elder Nelson's talk and we shall continue to hear more of the same. In fact, I doubt I shall ever live to see the day when a GA proclaims anything but exclusivity for exaltation. That doesn't mean there are in the eternities exceptions or other methodologies for salvation and exaltation, but only you won't find them preached by leadership.

It was a weird way of approaching the topic, but not too surprising.

So the Gospel is essentially a giant wink and nod exercise?

CardiacCoug · 10-08-2008, 09:35 PM

In an earthly correctional facility you aren't allowed to be with your spouse. Why would you be allowed to be with your spouse in the Spirit Correctional Facility?

Just like solving an equation. It's all about logic, folks.

Tex · 10-08-2008, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jay santos

Notice I've never suggested people can "be united eternally without being sealed and/or failing to live up to their covenants".

I just have an extreme problem with people speaking with certainty of items 1,2,3 from previous post.

What did you expect him to say? "D&C 132 teaches that all connections, associations, and expectations not made by the priesthood are of no efficacy, but who knows? Maybe you'll get visitation rights"?

jay santos · 10-08-2008, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex

What did you expect him to say? "D&C 132 teaches that all connections, associations, and expectations not made by the priesthood are of no efficacy, but who knows? Maybe you'll get visitation rights"?

He didn't need to say it at all. He was telling people who say a loved one was reunited with a deceased spouse that they're wrong. That's extremely direct and bold and potentially offensive. And it's not backed up by any clear, regularly taught doctrine.

Tex · 10-08-2008, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jay santos

He didn't need to say it at all. He was telling people who say a loved one was reunited with a deceased spouse that they're wrong. That's extremely direct and bold and potentially offensive. And it's not backed up by any clear, regularly taught doctrine.

How is that not backed up by the verse he quoted following?

scottie · 10-08-2008, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indy Coug

What a ridiculous characterization. I'm not kicking anybody. I don't make the rules. However, I do believe that Elder Nelson has a better fix on what the rules are than you or I do for this particular matter.

Who here besides Indy believes this?

Flystripper · 10-08-2008, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CardiacCoug

In an earthly correctional facility you aren't allowed to be with your spouse. Why would you be allowed to be with your spouse in the Spirit Correctional Facility?

Just like solving an equation. It's all about logic, folks.

Conjugal visits are allowed in some prisons. I am hoping this logic holds true for me.

myboynoah · 10-08-2008, 09:46 PM

I too thought it rather harsh and in need of clarification for non-Mormons like SU (oh, I forgot, SU is still a Mormon). I remember as a newly married couple sitting with non-member friends of my wife (I nipped that in the bud quickly, and for good reason as you will see) discussing the temple and the states of souls after death. I noted our belief in "eternal marriage" and that I would be with my wife after death.

One friend responded that she fully expected to be with her spouse after death as well, not necessarily as man and wife, but that they would be together. I still don't see why she is not correct.

Hence, I see Elder Nelson's reading of the obit as fairly narrow in his interpretation, and probably no where the original intent of the author.

There, that's all the criticism of The Bretheren that I can muster for one day.

The_Tick · 10-08-2008, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottie

Who here besides Indy believes this?

Me.

I am fairly sure an Apostle of the Lord has things figured out a little better than I do.

10-08-2008, 09:46 PM	#29
myboynoah Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Memphis freakin' Tennessee!!!!! Posts: 4,530	I too thought it rather harsh and in need of clarification for non-Mormons like SU (oh, I forgot, SU is still a Mormon). I remember as a newly married couple sitting with non-member friends of my wife (I nipped that in the bud quickly, and for good reason as you will see) discussing the temple and the states of souls after death. I noted our belief in "eternal marriage" and that I would be with my wife after death. One friend responded that she fully expected to be with her spouse after death as well, not necessarily as man and wife, but that they would be together. I still don't see why she is not correct. Hence, I see Elder Nelson's reading of the obit as fairly narrow in his interpretation, and probably no where the original intent of the author. There, that's all the criticism of The Bretheren that I can muster for one day. __________________ Give 'em Hell, Cougars!!! Religion rises inevitably from our apprehension of our own death. To give meaning to meaninglessness is the endless quest of all religion. When death becomes the center of our consciousness, then religion authentically begins. Of all religions that I know, the one that most vehemently and persuasively defies and denies the reality of death is the original Mormonism of the Prophet, Seer and Revelator, Joseph Smith.

10-08-2008, 09:35 PM	#23
CardiacCoug Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 471	In an earthly correctional facility you aren't allowed to be with your spouse. Why would you be allowed to be with your spouse in the Spirit Correctional Facility? Just like solving an equation. It's all about logic, folks.