Question about the missionary program "raising the bar"

[BlueK]

Originally Posted by Archaea

In Germany, there were almost no baptisms regardless of salesmanship. One month, the entire mission baptized less than ten, I believe it was six. That was 150 elders and sisters in total. At the same time, I got a letter from my friend in Tokyo South, where he personally baptized 50 persons. Needless to say, I didn't exactly write him to say we hadn't baptized in seven months.

Whether it was linked to righteousness or not is for somebody else to judge, but our baptisms weren't about salesmanship. They were mana from heaven that nobody created or delivered. Suddenly, you find a rare German soul that was interested and nothing we did, could screw it up.

And I thought it went slow in Holland. Not quite that bad, but pretty close.

[jay santos]

Originally Posted by Archaea

In Germany, there were almost no baptisms regardless of salesmanship. One month, the entire mission baptized less than ten, I believe it was six. That was 150 elders and sisters in total. At the same time, I got a letter from my friend in Tokyo South, where he personally baptized 50 persons. Needless to say, I didn't exactly write him to say we hadn't baptized in seven months.

Whether it was linked to righteousness or not is for somebody else to judge, but our baptisms weren't about salesmanship. They were mana from heaven that nobody created or delivered. Suddenly, you find a rare German soul that was interested and nothing we did, could screw it up.

50 baptisms in a month in Japan??? Wow, that's pretty amazing. I would think that would be a banner month for an entire mission.

[jay santos]

Originally Posted by Indy Coug

In the absence of really knowing what the church policy actually is, why weigh in on whether you like it or not?

If you're talking to me, I do know what the policy is. I read it. And I know how at least a handful of bishops interpret it.

[Archaea]

Originally Posted by jay santos

50 baptisms in a month in Japan??? Wow, that's pretty amazing. I would think that would be a banner month for an entire mission.

During the Kikuchi years. My friend failed to inform me that he was released early for a "friendship" with a convert.

[myboynoah]

Originally Posted by jay santos

50 baptisms in a month in Japan??? Wow, that's pretty amazing. I would think that would be a banner month for an entire mission.

That was an interesting time for The Church in Japan, and in the Tokyo South Mission in particular. And I'm not using the very positive interpretation of "interesting." I leave it to someone else closer to the situation to discuss the particulars, but there was a major clean-up project after that era.

[MikeWaters]

My mom was supposedly a superstar missionary in Japan. When she visits Japan she is greeted as a minor LDS celebrity. According to my dad.

[myboynoah]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

My mom was supposedly a superstar missionary in Japan. When she visits Japan she is greeted as a minor LDS celebrity. According to my dad.

We called her "Mike no Okasama-sama"

[Archaea]

Originally Posted by myboynoah

We called her "Mike no Okasama-sama"

not, O-Mike no Okasama-sama-ohama?

[RockyBalboa]

Originally Posted by Mormon Red Death

Since they have raised the bar they are not allowing missionaries that have had premarital sex right?

Doesn't that seem counter to the doctrine of repentance? Anybody have any insight into the reasoning here?

That is a myth..they can go...they just have to go through the process.

They still allow them if they've had pre-marital sex, they just have to be like everyone else and wait a year. As far as my understanding goes even before the raising the of the bar...that was the norm. 1 year wait minimum. Some kids have sex when they're 15, 16, 17,,,but by the time they turn 19 have already gone through the repentance process and left for a mission.

[SteelBlue]

Originally Posted by RockyBalboa

That is a myth..they can go...they just have to go through the process.

They still allow them if they've had pre-marital sex, they just have to be like everyone else and wait a year. As far as my understanding goes even before the raising the of the bar...that was the norm. 1 year wait minimum. Some kids have sex when they're 15, 16, 17,,,but by the time they turn 19 have already gone through the repentance process and left for a mission.

The main difference now is that multiple partners is close to the death penalty as far as serving a mission goes. They have backed off slightly from the initial bar raising allowing for more of an "appeals process" shall we say. Prior to raising the bar one could have had significant "experience" and still go.

I think the intention, as BlueK said, was to have prospective Elders preparing their whole youth to serve. I fully agree that one of the unintended (or perhaps it was well understood) consequences is that some of the best people persons will be excluded. Let's face it, that's how some of them got into trouble in the first place.