This Anti-Beck crap is ridiculously hilarious

[Surfah]

Originally Posted by TheSizzle36

Here is where I will disagree. If a team is going to be worth ANYTHING it needs a leader to step up. Somebody who, if the line isn't doing its job will get in their face and bitch them out. Somebody who if a receiver drops an open pass, the quarterback is in his grill. Somebody who his teammates don't want to let down, who has earned their respect so when they get yelled at, they want to do better.

As much as I like Beck, he is not that in-your-face type leader that the team needs IMO, and Beck, by his off the field work ethic has earned that type of respect from his teammates that makes him the leader. He watches more film than anybody else. He is the last one to leave the practice field, usually working on his timing with a receiver on routes that he struggled with during practice. But it's not his personality from what I've seen to be an in your face leader. And so offensively, the team has taken on his personality. A lot of potential, solid most of the time, but prone to mistakes and lapses, and a team that gets tight under pressure.

Beck is very... for lack of better word, he's very business in the way he approcahes the game. It's like it's a job, and he takes it seriously. But there are times when as a QB you need to be having fun, and there are times when as a QB you need to get on a guy. In my 3 years of watching John Beck, I can only remember him really getting on a guy once or twice... even in practice. IMO, I think that for BYU to take it to the next level next season, Beck needs to be more of a motivating/vocal leader, if that makes sense, instead of the leader by example that he is right now.

Yeah we'd love to see John Beck turn into Rich Gannon or Brett Favre and bitch out his team, but honestly the team shouldn't need that sort of personality to be motivated. Bronco should be motivating the team and if the team is taking after the QB's personality then in my opinion that is Bronco's fault, not Beck's.

And I am not sure that sort of personality is something that would have made a difference. With Berry right behind him there was already a rift on the team, if Beck came out with "I am going to tear you a new asshole" approach to team leadership it quite possibly could have made things even worse.

I think really what people miss in our QBs is the confidence that almost exuded a swagger. That swagger only comes from having confidence in your team. And with so much change within the program during Beck's tenure as QB it's hard to fault him for not having that confidence in his line, his defense, the playcalling, etc.

I don't want to sound like a Beck apologist, maybe I am, but the kid has been getting hammered unjustly IMO. It's July and already blue tinted CBers are frothing at the mouth and a Pro-Beck/Anti-Beck war on the board is imminent reminiscient of the old Crowtonite threads. It's all stupid.

[TheSizzle36]

Originally Posted by cougjunkie

He single handedly beat New Mexico this year, and kept us close against Cal. I agree there are things that Beck does that I question, at times he looks great other times average at best.

For example if he hits Harline on that crossing route against Utah we win that game instead he overthrows him by 5 feet, after looking like the best QB in america for most of the second half.

I'll have to disagree with you on the New Mexico game. BYU had no business winning that game, none whatsoever. But I will give Beck some credit as when the fluke fumble (sometimes it really is better to be lucky than good) happened, he was able to drive the team down and score. Props to Beck on that one.

Beck also played a pretty good game against Cal as well, I'll give him credit for that one too. But at times under the gun, Beck struggles. And that sucks. Outside of New Mexico, most struggle to give an example of Beck making the clutch plays to win the game when his back is against the wall.

Clearly Beck is the best we have right now, I'm not trying to dispute that or stir up a quarterback controversy. But at the same time, ask yourself this question. If the game were on the line, you needed to go 65 yards for a TD, how comfortable would you feel with Beck as your quarterback? How comfortable would you feel with Doman? How comfortable would you feel with Detmer? How comfortable would you feel with McMahon? That is how you can define a great quarterback, IMO, when the game is on the line you KNOW that he'll find a way to get that done. Beck isn't there yet, but he still has a season to prove me wrong. I hope that he does.

[El Guapo]

I really like Beck. I feel like he gets a bad rap too. If a receiver dropped a pass when the game was on the line, people would blame Beck for not getting him the ball.

The guy has sensational numbers, and he has gotten them while playing under two completely different offenses. His progress from his first year to last year was huge. I look for great things from Beck this year.

BYU did lose some tough games last year, but can you really blame Beck for the losses? How about putting the blame with the defense where it belongs?

[TheSizzle36]

Originally Posted by surfah33

Yeah we'd love to see John Beck turn into Rich Gannon or Brett Favre and bitch out his team, but honestly the team shouldn't need that sort of personality to be motivated. Bronco should be motivating the team and if the team is taking after the QB's personality then in my opinion that is Bronco's fault, not Beck's.

And I am not sure that sort of personality is something that would have made a difference. With Berry right behind him there was already a rift on the team, if Beck came out with "I am going to tear you a new asshole" approach to team leadership it quite possibly could have made things even worse.

I think really what people miss in our QBs is the confidence that almost exuded a swagger. That swagger only comes from having confidence in your team. And with so much change within the program during Beck's tenure as QB it's hard to fault him for not having that confidence in his line, his defense, the playcalling, etc.

I don't want to sound like a Beck apologist, maybe I am, but the kid has been getting hammered unjustly IMO. It's July and already blue tinted CBers are frothing at the mouth and a Pro-Beck/Anti-Beck war on the board is imminent reminiscient of the old Crowtonite threads. It's all stupid.

Coaches can coach and motivate, but ultimately, every team that I've been on takes the personality of its team leader. Some of the blame probably does need to fall on Bronco's shoulders as well.

Has Beck taken some unfair criticism? Yes. Does Beck deserve some as well? Absolutely. I would be willing to bet that Beck also would admit that he hasn't played up to what he feels that he is capable of.

As far as last season, there was NO QUESTION who the leader of the team was. It was Beck 100%. Berry was an afterthough. Yes, in previous years, Beck and Berry had some controversy, and there was a question. And Beck probably took some heat because he was "Crowton's guy". But from an unbiased observer, Beck looked much better than Berry in most cases and deserved the playing time that he earned. It will be interesting to see if Beck feels more comfortable this season without Matt Berry behind him and if he can assume a more vocal role of a team leader.

As far as tearing a teammate a new asshole when he screws up, if you've earned the respect that Beck has by his work ethic, then guys will listen. I'd much rather have a guy who when a mistake is made rallies the guys together to get their heads in line for the next time to get over it and move on. My biggest complaint against Beck is probably this. When he makes a mistake, it's off to the bench to think it over, dwell about it, etc. If Beck can have a short memory when he makes a mistake, his consistency will improve, as will his late game play. Too often he worries about making a mistake instead of making a play, IMO, and that is what gets him in trouble.

[SoCalCoug]

I predict that after this season, the complaints about Beck not being able to win games, and not making the extra pass are going to seem silly.

We're comparing him to guys who have already had their senior year.

Here's how I look at it: I couldn't wait for Feterik to graduate. I couldn't wait for Engemann to get benched. I was happy to see Walsh leave early. I didn't think those guys were up to par. As for Beck, I'm really looking forward to seeing him play this year. I think he's going to answer his critics.

[TheSizzle36]

Originally Posted by Mr Wise Guy

Too often he worries about making a mistake instead of making a play, IMO, and that is what gets him in trouble.

When Beck proves this wrong, I'll agree SoCal.

The thing is, I like Beck. I'm behind him. Stating an area where I think that he needs to improve does not place me in the Anti-Beck crowd... at least I don't think it does. And since you're probably saying, no duh numb nuts, I'll shut up now.

[il Padrino Ute]

I think Beck is fine. He does what he can with the teammates that surround him. The few times I saw him play I noticed that there were moments where he panicked just a bit and hurried things - in the Utah game I honestly think if he would have tucked the ball, put his head down and went hard, he would have gotten the first down in the OT, but he threw the ball instead. He seemed to me that he'd rather throw the ball away than take a hit.

It also didn't help him that Watkins dropped way too many balls. Brown was a very effective running back, but from my perspective, his running game didn't seem to compliment Beck's passing enough to help Beck. That may have been the receivers' fault for not taking advantage of Brown's ability to force a defense to focus on his running - they should have had some open lanes in the intermediate routes. At times, it also looked like the O-line was a sieve.

I don't know what the anti-Beck crowd wants. The guy was First Team All-Conference. First team All-Conference is pretty dang good in my book.

[Archaea]

Sure Paddy you think Beck is fine, Utah has womped his two times now.

I really want some of the Utah QBs from the early eighties back as well. Do you think you can import them?

The bottom line with Beck, is if he stays within himself, we can do okay, but he is not a world beater. He is not McMahon, Young, Detmer or even Sark, so as long as his surrounding players win for us, we can win. If we have to rely upon him making the play, we lose.

[Archaea]

Originally Posted by TheSizzle36

When Beck proves this wrong, I'll agree SoCal.

The thing is, I like Beck. I'm behind him. Stating an area where I think that he needs to improve does not place me in the Anti-Beck crowd... at least I don't think it does. And since you're probably saying, no duh numb nuts, I'll shut up now.

I'm not anti-Beck per se, just pro BYU.

I want BYU to win, and Beck doesn't inspire me as a firey McMahon or Young that will make it happen. You almost sense those willing us to victory.

I'd be happy if Beck remains a cog in the system and let the system win for us, rather than rely upon extraordinary plays by Beck.

Beck seems to get ahead of himself, frequently looking for the long ball, not patient enough, not willing to go to the run.

In Utah, why did we allow Brown to run us back and then we stopped using him. Brown brought us back, not Beck and then Beck didn't finish.

[TheSizzle36]

Originally Posted by Archaea

I'm not anti-Beck per se, just pro BYU.

I want BYU to win, and Beck doesn't inspire me as a firey McMahon or Young that will make it happen. You almost sense those willing us to victory.

I'd be happy if Beck remains a cog in the system and let the system win for us, rather than rely upon extraordinary plays by Beck.

Beck seems to get ahead of himself, frequently looking for the long ball, not patient enough, not willing to go to the run.

In Utah, why did we allow Brown to run us back and then we stopped using him. Brown brought us back, not Beck and then Beck didn't finish.

Earlier I said:

Clearly Beck is the best we have right now, I'm not trying to dispute that or stir up a quarterback controversy. But at the same time, ask yourself this question. If the game were on the line, you needed to go 65 yards for a TD, how comfortable would you feel with Beck as your quarterback? How comfortable would you feel with Doman? How comfortable would you feel with Detmer? How comfortable would you feel with McMahon? That is how you can define a great quarterback, IMO, when the game is on the line you KNOW that he'll find a way to get that done. Beck isn't there yet, but he still has a season to prove me wrong. I hope that he does.

I agree exactly. Beck doesn't inspire that confidence that when he has the ball you know BYU is going to come back and win.

I should say that I am pro-Beck because right now, and the last three season, he was BYU's best option (were Berry healthy, the story may have been different).

What I'm trying to say Archea, is that you pretty much nailed it.