07-12-2007, 11:04 PM | #21 |
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Well the article says that there was no pay scale difference between apostles and seventies during David O. McKay's tenure.
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07-12-2007, 11:07 PM | #22 | |
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One does not get the impression that the ancient apostles had incomes that put them in the top 1% of their society. Or even top 5%. That's why I don't understand the comparison between GAs and CEOs. What does it say about GAs if not one of them actually makes MORE from their stipend than their previous job. It fits into the stereotype of only well-off Mormons are called to ecclesiastical hierarchy, the so-called wallet biopsy. |
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07-12-2007, 11:15 PM | #23 |
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The passage below from 1 Corinthians 9 might help us think about compensation for those who work "full time" in the Church. Paul draws on the OT practice of the Levitical priests living off the sacrifices brought to the temple. I don't think I've ever heard a fellow Mormon quote this passage, but if the Church is compelled to make such things public because of the lawsuit, it may become an instant favorite.
1 Cor. 9: 1-14 (NRSV) 1 Am I not free? Am I not an apostle? Have I not seen Jesus our Lord? Are you not my work in the Lord? 2 If I am not an apostle to others, at least I am to you; for you are the seal of my apostleship in the Lord. 3 This is my defense to those who would examine me. 4 Do we not have the right to our food and drink? 5 Do we not have the right to be accompanied by a believing wife, as do the other apostles and the brothers of the Lord and Cephas? 6 Or is it only Barnabas and I who have no right to refrain from working for a living? 7 Who at any time pays the expenses for doing military service? Who plants a vineyard and does not eat any of its fruit? Or who tends a flock and does not get any of its milk? 8 Do I say this on human authority? Does not the law also say the same? 9 For it is written in the law of Moses, "You shall not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain." Is it for oxen that God is concerned? 10 Or does he not speak entirely for our sake? It was indeed written for our sake, for whoever plows should plow in hope and whoever threshes should thresh in hope of a share in the crop. 11 If we have sown spiritual good among you, is it too much if we reap your material benefits? 12 If others share this rightful claim on you, do not we still more? Nevertheless, we have not made use of this right, but we endure anything rather than put an obstacle in the way of the gospel of Christ. 13 Do you not know that those who are employed in the temple service get their food from the temple, and those who serve at the altar share in what is sacrificed on the altar? 14 In the same way, the Lord commanded that those who proclaim the gospel should get their living by the gospel. I'll add that one of the benefits of compensating GAs (and possibly, Mission Presidents) is that one should not have to be rich to be a GA. The fact that most of the GAs seem to be rather well off sends a message that riches = righteousness, and that's not consistent with the scriptures (and I'm not meaning to bash on the wealthy, they can be righteous too).
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"Do not despise the words of prophets, but test everything; hold fast to what is good; " 1 Thess. 5:21 (NRSV) We all trust our own unorthodoxies. Last edited by Sleeping in EQ; 07-12-2007 at 11:23 PM. |
07-12-2007, 11:18 PM | #24 |
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I've found an inaccuracy in the article:
It says that until 1908 Mormons were allowed to pay tithing in-kind (paraphrasing here). Actually, the church still accepts in-kind tithing. The church has an entire department set up for handling in-kind donations: Donations-in-Kind The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints 50 E North Temple Salt Lake City, UT 84150-3600 North American members are encouraged to pay in cash; however, many members in 3rd-world countries still pay in-kind. |
07-12-2007, 11:24 PM | #25 | |
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07-12-2007, 11:24 PM | #26 | |
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That would put them in the top 1% of Americans. THey have to sacrifice to come down to the top 1%? What about the saints that make less than 250k? Will they all be hometeachers? (BTW, some of the apostles were not well off when called, many died relatively poor, and I don't know that the 250k figure is accurate). |
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07-12-2007, 11:29 PM | #27 |
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Along these same lines, there is a guy in my ward who is really, really strong in the church, is the right age to be a Bishop.
I wonder if his being down on his luck for a long time (delivering papers and pizzas), despite really being quite intelligent and gifted, hurt him in terms of consideration for callings. There is the tendency, which I think is naturual (or maybe to some degree the natural man), to push these men out of your mind as "less able." Maybe it was my imagination, but he really seemed to perk up when he was called to be on the high council. More recently he was called to be a counselor in the Bishopric (replacing a young lawyer who moved). I will say, in an urban ward with a dearth of able leadership, even someone like me can be called to something responsible. Which is scary. So in a way, his experience goes against the stereotype (at least his recent past) to some degree. Before he was called to be a counselor, he got a job as a schoolteacher. Which is great for his family. |
07-12-2007, 11:30 PM | #28 | |
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07-12-2007, 11:36 PM | #29 | |
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07-12-2007, 11:41 PM | #30 | |
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