Intellectually, I'll pose the question to you LDS liberals and the few apostates here

[Archaea]

Unless you're gay yourself, why the affinity for gayness and its politics?

Emotionally, it means nothing to me. I have no family who is gay; of course, I have almost no family whatsoever, so familial bonds are almost unknown. What bonds my extended family has is completely dysfunctional. I know of maybe one successful family unit in my entire extended family.

In short sum, people have affinity because (a) it involves sex and everybody should be able to get his rocks off [Seattle even went so far as to attack me ad hominenally, saying I was cruel for not wanting gay men to ejaculate], (b) it arises "naturally" so God must have a plan for it, and (c) our leaders, the scriptures and any discussion is uninspired as to it, and (d) let's just people do whatever they please with whatever health consequences arise and costs of any social activities should never be questioned because it involves sex.

These are not very persuasive to me.

As I see it we are receive our personal pain. Most of life is painful. Sometimes, not seeking sympathy and if I got it, I would punch you in the nose, everything we encounter is painful. About the only reason for joy involves our kids, our jobs and sometimes athletics or religious joy, but these are momentary only to be connected in the hereafter. For the most part, there is simply tremendous pain. It is why athletics relieves emotional pain because it focuses upon physical pain as opposed to emotional, although endurance events are also mental.

So for people to legitimize gayness by virtue of sympathy for the pain, isn't all life pain with only brief respites of joy?

I just cannot relate. And the arguments built by gay sympathizers such as yourselves does not connect logically. It includes so many unprovable assumptions and that in of itself is illogical.

I guess I will never understand, especially LDS liberals. Apostates will believe whatever they choose, as they are freed from any connection to LDS theology, epistomology or etymology. It almost seems as if LDS liberals really don't believe God has revealed anything, only that the LDS Church functions as an appropriate social organization. If that is all I believed the LDS church to be, I wouldn't be involved. It costs too much for too little.

Can anybody make philosophically rational argument unrelated to the words "fair", or "God wouldn't make somebody suffer if it weren't permissible", or "nobody would wish that upon themselves so it must be normal". Those are simply ciruitous logic without a premise, deduction and conclusion. The logic is nonexistent.

Pain is a necessary, inescapable part of life. Sex invokes pain and rarely joy. Without excrutiating pain, there is no growth.

Work a muscle, you must agonize it and then allow it to heal and start over again.

Same with spiritual growth, emotional and intellectual.