Bronco--cougjunkie's post

[jay santos]

http://www.cougarboard.com/nologin/m...tml?id=2588289

Cougjunkie upset a few people with this post. I agree but also disagree.

What I don't give Bronco any credit for:

1. Winning with a senior Beck, Brown, Harline (anyone could have done it)
2. Hiring a good offensive coordinator (Anae was not Bronco's choice, he was forced to hire him)
3. Winning the "right" way, i.e program is more spiritual (don't believe it, I think it's mostly all talk and the part that's not all talk, any decent coach would have come in and fixed anyway)
4. Improved organization, attitude, discipline, focus, etc. other intangibles. (I think these are generally a result of winning not the cause of winning. Lose a few games and the wheels usually come off: you have accusations of undiscipline, quitting, disunity, etc. Win a few games and the opposite.)
5. Bowl season his first year. (That team didn't improve much at all on Crowton's last season though they had more experience--only difference was schedule got easier)

What I do give Bronco credit for:

1. Making key defensive changes in 2006, i.e. 3-4, less blitzing, Hill hire. 2006 defense was stellar and came out of nowhere. That was huge.
2. Developing a BYU offense that is different than TT offense and incorporates more of the TE pass and the running game. Anae wanted to go straight TT offense. But the offense evolved that first season, and now looks more like a Chow offense than a TT offense. I credit Reynolds and Bronco for that.
3. Great recruiting class this year. Includes most of the great LDS recruits but also some non-LDS including two black non-LDS high school corners. A rare find for BYU.
4. Recent comments that he plans to go more conservative this year and rely more on the running game.
5. His coaching hires are getting better as he learns what he wants in a staff.
6. Dumbed down his over-the-top spirit/church talk and changed his approach to recruiting non-LDS.

What I blame Bronco for:

1. Worse D in 2005 than we should have had given the talent, resulting in underachieving as a team.
2. Mediocre to bad recruiting classes his first two years.
3. Marginal coaching hires his first year.
4. Over-the-top language tying the church and spirit to his football team which includes and targets in recruiting less active LDS and non-LDS.

The good thing is that all four of the blame for Bronco items have since turned into credit items as he's adjusted.

[RockyBalboa]

Originally Posted by jay santos

http://www.cougarboard.com/nologin/m...tml?id=2588289

Cougjunkie upset a few people with this post. I agree but also disagree.

What I don't give Bronco any credit for:

1. Winning with a senior Beck, Brown, Harline (anyone could have done it)
2. Hiring a good offensive coordinator (Anae was not Bronco's choice, he was forced to hire him)
3. Winning the "right" way, i.e program is more spiritual (don't believe it, I think it's mostly all talk and the part that's not all talk, any decent coach would have come in and fixed anyway)
4. Improved organization, attitude, discipline, focus, etc. other intangibles. (I think these are generally a result of winning not the cause of winning. Lose a few games and the wheels usually come off: you have accusations of undiscipline, quitting, disunity, etc. Win a few games and the opposite.)
5. Bowl season his first year. (That team didn't improve much at all on Crowton's last season though they had more experience--only difference was schedule got easier)

What I do give Bronco credit for:

1. Making key defensive changes in 2006, i.e. 3-4, less blitzing, Hill hire. 2006 defense was stellar and came out of nowhere. That was huge.
2. Developing a BYU offense that is different than TT offense and incorporates more of the TE pass and the running game. Anae wanted to go straight TT offense. But the offense evolved that first season, and now looks more like a Chow offense than a TT offense. I credit Reynolds and Bronco for that.
3. Great recruiting class this year. Includes most of the great LDS recruits but also some non-LDS including two black non-LDS high school corners. A rare find for BYU.
4. Recent comments that he plans to go more conservative this year and rely more on the running game.
5. His coaching hires are getting better as he learns what he wants in a staff.
6. Dumbed down his over-the-top spirit/church talk and changed his approach to recruiting non-LDS.

What I blame Bronco for:

1. Worse D in 2005 than we should have had given the talent, resulting in underachieving as a team.
2. Mediocre to bad recruiting classes his first two years.
3. Marginal coaching hires his first year.
4. Over-the-top language tying the church and spirit to his football team which includes and targets in recruiting less active LDS and non-LDS.

The good thing is that all four of the blame for Bronco items have since turned into credit items as he's adjusted.

Back up the mediocre two bad recruiting classes his first two years comment.

[Indy Coug]

Originally Posted by RockyBalboa

Back up the mediocre two bad recruiting classes his first two years comment.

Yeah, I'm not sure how you determine the quality one way or the other this quickly.

[jay santos]

Originally Posted by RockyBalboa

Back up the mediocre two bad recruiting classes his first two years comment.

2006 there were 21 LDS athletes rated with three stars or above by Rivals or Scout. We got 7 of them. That's not a good hit rate. 2007 we did much better. The 2006 class, KW wasn't accurate with his 9/10 or whatever, but he could have made a case he outrecruited BYU in state and for LDS Polynesians.

Combined 2005 and 2006 we recruited four non-LDS. Howard, Robinson, Bolden, Saulsberry. Pretty pathetic bunch.

Recruiting's hard to measure, but compared over a ten year time period, 2005/6 were two our worst years and 2007 was one of our best.

[RockyBalboa]

Originally Posted by jay santos

2006 there were 21 LDS athletes rated with three stars or above by Rivals or Scout. We got 7 of them. That's not a good hit rate. 2007 we did much better. The 2006 class, KW wasn't accurate with his 9/10 or whatever, but he could have made a case he outrecruited BYU in state and for LDS Polynesians.

Combined 2005 and 2006 we recruited four non-LDS. Howard, Robinson, Bolden, Saulsberry. Pretty pathetic bunch.

Recruiting's hard to measure, but compared over a ten year time period, 2005/6 were two our worst years and 2007 was one of our best.

That was your defense right? How exactly are you taking 05/06 into account based on a 10 year time period when not many of these kids have even seen the field yet?

[Archaea]

I am worried that the weak 2005, and I am uncertain that 2006 was as weak will harm the program in a few years.

[RockyBalboa]

06 signees:

CB -Brandon Bradley: Injured, redshirted, did not play

DL -Matangi Tonga: Contributed significant minutes on the D-line as a true freshman. Now at UVSC, then likely a mission and who knows if comes back to BYU after or not.

DL - Jordan Richardson: Redshirted, headed on a mission.

LB - Brandon Ogletree: Went directly on mission.

DL/JC - Mosese Foketi: Injured, redshirted, did not play.

CB/JC - Andre Saulsberry: Ended up getting Special Teams duty on occasion. Battling for a spot in Spring football right now.

DL - Romney Fuga: Contributed significant minutes on the D-line as a true freshman. Participating in Spring Ball and leaving on a mission after.

OL - Braden Hansen: Redshirted, sat out due to injury. Now on a mission.

DL - Ian Dulan: Contributed significant minutes til knocked out with leg injury. Will play 07' and then leave on mission.

CB/JC - Tico Pringle: Played sparingly back up corner duty, saw signifcant reps in the Utah game. Left school after the season.

DL/TE - Mike Muehlman: Left directly on a mission

OL - Walter Kahaiali'l - Redshirted

OL - Rick Wolfley - Redshirted

OL - Tom Sorenson - Hurt knee after returning from mission. Redshirted.

QB - Max Hall - Ruled ineligible, had to sit out 06 season. Ran the scout team.

OL - Ryan Freeman - Contributed significant minutes on the Offensive Line as a true freshman.

K - Riley Stephenson - Left directly on mission

S - Michael Moore - Sat out the season due to severe neck injury. End of season, decided to quit the team, get married and focus on studies. Still at BYU for school.

CB - Robbie Buckner - Redshirted, left on mission after season.

QB - James Lark - Redshirted, is leaving on mission later in the summer.

WR - Rhen Brown - Left directly on mission

LB - Nate Moncur - Never enrolled in school due to many physical problems, will likely never play D-I football. Also has other issues outside of schoolwork and physical problems.

QB - Sam Doman - Redshirted after coming off of mission

WR - McKay Jacobsen - Contributed significantly as a true freshman. Gone on mission now.

RB - Mike Hague - Played Special Teams consistently and back up carries in blowouts. Gone on mission.


It's pretty ridiculous to label the 06' class as bad or mediocre depending on what was put above.

[jay santos]

Originally Posted by RockyBalboa

06 signees:

CB -Brandon Bradley: Injured, redshirted, did not play

DL -Matangi Tonga: Contributed significant minutes on the D-line as a true freshman. Now at UVSC, then likely a mission and who knows if comes back to BYU after or not.

DL - Jordan Richardson: Redshirted, headed on a mission.

LB - Brandon Ogletree: Went directly on mission.

DL/JC - Mosese Foketi: Injured, redshirted, did not play.

CB/JC - Andre Saulsberry: Ended up getting Special Teams duty on occasion. Battling for a spot in Spring football right now.

DL - Romney Fuga: Contributed significant minutes on the D-line as a true freshman. Participating in Spring Ball and leaving on a mission after.

OL - Braden Hansen: Redshirted, sat out due to injury. Now on a mission.

DL - Ian Dulan: Contributed significant minutes til knocked out with leg injury. Will play 07' and then leave on mission.

CB/JC - Tico Pringle: Played sparingly back up corner duty, saw signifcant reps in the Utah game. Left school after the season.

DL/TE - Mike Muehlman: Left directly on a mission

OL - Walter Kahaiali'l - Redshirted

OL - Rick Wolfley - Redshirted

OL - Tom Sorenson - Hurt knee after returning from mission. Redshirted.

QB - Max Hall - Ruled ineligible, had to sit out 06 season. Ran the scout team.

OL - Ryan Freeman - Contributed significant minutes on the Offensive Line as a true freshman.

K - Riley Stephenson - Left directly on mission

S - Michael Moore - Sat out the season due to severe neck injury. End of season, decided to quit the team, get married and focus on studies. Still at BYU for school.

CB - Robbie Buckner - Redshirted, left on mission after season.

QB - James Lark - Redshirted, is leaving on mission later in the summer.

WR - Rhen Brown - Left directly on mission

LB - Nate Moncur - Never enrolled in school due to many physical problems, will likely never play D-I football. Also has other issues outside of schoolwork and physical problems.

QB - Sam Doman - Redshirted after coming off of mission

WR - McKay Jacobsen - Contributed significantly as a true freshman. Gone on mission now.

RB - Mike Hague - Played Special Teams consistently and back up carries in blowouts. Gone on mission.


It's pretty ridiculous to label the 06' class as bad or mediocre depending on what was put above.

School Recruit Position Scout Stars Rivals Stars
BYU James Lark QB 4 3
BYU Matangi Tonga DL 4 3
BYU Ryan Freeman OL 3 3
BYU McKay Jacobson WR/TE 3
BYU Tico Pringle DB 3
BYU Romney Fuga DL 2 3
ASU Martin Tevaseu DL 3 3
Utah Joe Faifili DL 3 4
Utah Pauli Latu DL 3 3
Utah Neli A'asa DL 3 3
Utah Aaron Tonga DL 3
Utah Zane Taylor DL 3
USC Stanley Havili RB 4 4
UCLA Sonny Tevaga OL 3
Stanford Sione Fua DL 4 3
SDSU Brian Stanbra DL 3 3
Oregon State Mau Nomani OL 3 3
Oregon State Joe Halahuni WR/TE 3
Oregon Fenuki Tupou OL 4 4
Idaho State Vilami Akoteu DL 3


It's not ridiculous in the least to say the job we did in recruiting that year was mediocre when we landed 1/3 of the top LDS. Also, instead of filling in with good non-LDS like we have in other years (Saulsberry was the only one), we filled in with mediocre or unrated LDS like Ogletree, Hansen, Wolfley, Brown, Doman.

[Goatnapper'96]

Originally Posted by jay santos

School Recruit Position Scout Stars Rivals Stars
BYU James Lark QB 4 3
BYU Matangi Tonga DL 4 3
BYU Ryan Freeman OL 3 3
BYU McKay Jacobson WR/TE 3
BYU Tico Pringle DB 3
BYU Romney Fuga DL 2 3
ASU Martin Tevaseu DL 3 3
Utah Joe Faifili DL 3 4
Utah Pauli Latu DL 3 3
Utah Neli A'asa DL 3 3
Utah Aaron Tonga DL 3
Utah Zane Taylor DL 3
USC Stanley Havili RB 4 4
UCLA Sonny Tevaga OL 3
Stanford Sione Fua DL 4 3
SDSU Brian Stanbra DL 3 3
Oregon State Mau Nomani OL 3 3
Oregon State Joe Halahuni WR/TE 3
Oregon Fenuki Tupou OL 4 4
Idaho State Vilami Akoteu DL 3


It's not ridiculous in the least to say the job we did in recruiting that year was mediocre when we landed 1/3 of the top LDS. Also, instead of filling in with good non-LDS like we have in other years (Saulsberry was the only one), we filled in with mediocre or unrated LDS like Ogletree, Hansen, Wolfley, Brown, Doman.

Teveasu, Faifili and Akoteau were not qualified for BYU. A'sa and Zane Taylor are not LDS. I think BYU missed on Latu, especially with the loss of Sione Fua whom they also missed on. BYU did not miss on Aaron Tonga, he was overrated and will probably never play at Utah. I don't think BYU offered Stanbra. I don't know much about the guys at Oregon and OSU. Everyone knows how much I lament losing Havili. Top notch LDS skill players hurt more to lose than 5 4* Poly OL or DL. BYU landed a great deal of LDS lineman on both sides of the ball so others going to Utah or Oregon don't hurt that much, IMO. I would have liked to have seen BYU get one more DL out of that 2006 class, but the loss of Havili was and is huge.

In the end I thought BYU missed on either Latu/Fua and Havili. But they did land Jacobsen and Lark. BYU needs to land in excess of 75% of the top notch LDS skill players IMO.

[RockyBalboa]

Originally Posted by jay santos

School Recruit Position Scout Stars Rivals Stars
BYU James Lark QB 4 3
BYU Matangi Tonga DL 4 3
BYU Ryan Freeman OL 3 3
BYU McKay Jacobson WR/TE 3
BYU Tico Pringle DB 3
BYU Romney Fuga DL 2 3
ASU Martin Tevaseu DL 3 3
Utah Joe Faifili DL 3 4
Utah Pauli Latu DL 3 3
Utah Neli A'asa DL 3 3
Utah Aaron Tonga DL 3
Utah Zane Taylor DL 3
USC Stanley Havili RB 4 4
UCLA Sonny Tevaga OL 3
Stanford Sione Fua DL 4 3
SDSU Brian Stanbra DL 3 3
Oregon State Mau Nomani OL 3 3
Oregon State Joe Halahuni WR/TE 3
Oregon Fenuki Tupou OL 4 4
Idaho State Vilami Akoteu DL 3


It's not ridiculous in the least to say the job we did in recruiting that year was mediocre when we landed 1/3 of the top LDS. Also, instead of filling in with good non-LDS like we have in other years (Saulsberry was the only one), we filled in with mediocre or unrated LDS like Ogletree, Hansen, Wolfley, Brown, Doman.

Star rankings mean exactly squat most of the time. For as much bitching and moaning that fans do about BYU not getting all the Top LDS recruits, they seem to hit a conundrum when trying to accommplish this while bringing in enough Non-LDS guys as well.

So far Bronco has done pretty well with that. It is not rational or logical to expect Bronco to get EVERY SINGLE highly rated LDS recruit.