about sexual abuse in the church

[MikeWaters]

obviously over the years there has been increasing concern.

Recent policy that men can't teach primary classes alone.

I'm very strict about the rules in scouts, no leaders and kids in tents, etc. Two-deep.

I explained to my asst. scoutmaster--one accusation can destroy your life. You have to be very careful.

So it cuts both ways. SoonerCoug is afraid of his leaders interacting with his kids, and I can assure you, if the leaders have any whiff of your line of thinking, they will steer as far away from your kids as possible. They will want nothing to do with them for fear of a crazy parent making an accusation.

We have one kid in our ward who is unfortunately inactive, and has been for a long time, but if he ever comes back, I can assure you that I will be quadrupuling all my measures, accounting for all time, etc. Mom is crazy.

The wolves are not in abundance, but they are frequent enough to be on guard a bit. But it can also be overdone.

[jay santos]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

obviously over the years there has been increasing concern.

Recent policy that men can't teach primary classes alone.

I'm very strict about the rules in scouts, no leaders and kids in tents, etc. Two-deep.

I explained to my asst. scoutmaster--one accusation can destroy your life. You have to be very careful.

So it cuts both ways. SoonerCoug is afraid of his leaders interacting with his kids, and I can assure you, if the leaders have any whiff of your line of thinking, they will steer as far away from your kids as possible. They will want nothing to do with them for fear of a crazy parent making an accusation.

We have one kid in our ward who is unfortunately inactive, and has been for a long time, but if he ever comes back, I can assure you that I will be quadrupuling all my measures, accounting for all time, etc. Mom is crazy.

The wolves are not in abundance, but they are frequent enough to be on guard a bit. But it can also be overdone.

Nothing is more scary to a parent than child sexual abuse. We are pretty cautious. No sleepovers. No male (even family member) is ever alone with our young kids. Very conscious of the rule making sure parents are home when a kid goes to a friend's house. Don't allow kids to go to a friends if they have a shady teenage brother. Always careful about things like swim parties, etc. We continually talk about the subject with the kids to make them more aware of higher risk situations and to keep an open dialogue of communication in case they need to talk to us but are scared.

But church related functions have never been much of a concern. Our ward's pretty good about two deep leadership and the group of kids always seem large enough to be safe.

[Archaea]

Am I a bit concerned yes?

Am I overly cautious moreso than I would have been twenty years ago? I dunno.

I have taught my children to defend themselves, to speak up and to avoid trobule, but I do not know how I'd behave if it happened to my kid.

We had a family in our ward who was abused by his sixteen year old cousin. Both he and the cousin were sent to counseling. The cousin later distraught over many things including the ostrasization he received as a result committed suicide. It was a horrible incident that cascaded into something worse.

[MikeWaters]

People who discover that they are gay sometimes kill themselves. Imagine how much worse it would be to discover that only children can bring you sexual arousal.

I imagine that was a big part of the suicide.

[SoonerCoug]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

So it cuts both ways. SoonerCoug is afraid of his leaders interacting with his kids, and I can assure you, if the leaders have any whiff of your line of thinking, they will steer as far away from your kids as possible. They will want nothing to do with them for fear of a crazy parent making an accusation.

We have one kid in our ward who is unfortunately inactive, and has been for a long time, but if he ever comes back, I can assure you that I will be quadrupuling all my measures, accounting for all time, etc. Mom is crazy.

The wolves are not in abundance, but they are frequent enough to be on guard a bit. But it can also be overdone.

I don't inherently distrust my Church leaders. I think the VAST majority are really great men.

I just think the detailed questioning is a little unnecessary, but I would never confront a bishop and tell him what questions are appropriate and what aren't. I go along with the system.

[jay santos]

Originally Posted by SoonerCoug

I don't inherently distrust my Church leaders. I think the VAST majority are really great men.

I just think the detailed questioning is a little unnecessary, but I would never confront a bishop and tell him what questions are appropriate and what aren't. I go along with the system.

That's interesting. I'm probably more trustful than you, but I've been thinking of talking to the bishop about what questions he asks teenagers, as my kids are getting that age. I think it's entirely appropriate for me as a parent to talk to the bishop about what he talks to my kids in a private interview. I won't get in his face or anything. I have a good relationship with my bishop and I trust him. But I think it would be a good conversation to have.

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

obviously over the years there has been increasing concern.

Recent policy that men can't teach primary classes alone.

I'm very strict about the rules in scouts, no leaders and kids in tents, etc. Two-deep.

I explained to my asst. scoutmaster--one accusation can destroy your life. You have to be very careful.

So it cuts both ways. SoonerCoug is afraid of his leaders interacting with his kids, and I can assure you, if the leaders have any whiff of your line of thinking, they will steer as far away from your kids as possible. They will want nothing to do with them for fear of a crazy parent making an accusation.

We have one kid in our ward who is unfortunately inactive, and has been for a long time, but if he ever comes back, I can assure you that I will be quadrupuling all my measures, accounting for all time, etc. Mom is crazy.

The wolves are not in abundance, but they are frequent enough to be on guard a bit. But it can also be overdone.

You accused SoonerCoug of making up stories about sexual abuse in the LDS Church. He produces evidence that it has happened, and then you accuse him of being paranoid about abuse.

[Archaea]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

You accused SoonerCoug of making up stories about sexual abuse in the LDS Church. He produces evidence that it has happened, and then you accuse him of being paranoid about abuse.

He cites a story from 13 years ago, for which we have one side of the story.

You probably know the Church counsel, as do I. I even know the lawyer partially responsible for adopting many of the new protocols concerning this activity.

The Church is very concerned about making certain it does all it can to prevent while observing other concerns.

And as Mike points out, given the horrible effect any allegation can make, a leader needs to be on guard, because the children and their parents are your potential worst nightmares.

[SoonerCoug]

Originally Posted by Archaea

He cites a story from 13 years ago, for which we have one side of the story.

I think that one side of the story includes some good evidence.

Here is what we know beyond any reasonable doubt:

1. Family accuses bishop of molesting child.
2. Allegations are ignored.
3. Family goes to media.
4. Family is excommunicated.
(Based on these four facts, the family could be completely wrong.)
5. Accused bishop is arrested for "indecent exposure" without describing his behavior in detail.
(Fact 5 suggests that the bishop was indeed a perv, and therefore lends credibility to the accusations.)
6. Bishop registers as a sex offender and leaves the state. Nevertheless, he sent me a beautiful wedding present. It still gets lots of use.

I think these facts support the family's side of the story.

[Archaea]

Originally Posted by SoonerCoug

I think that one side of the story includes some good evidence.

Here is what we know beyond any reasonable doubt:

1. Family accuses bishop of molesting child.
2. Allegations are ignored.
3. Family goes to media.
4. Family is excommunicated.
(Based on these four facts, the family could be completely wrong.)
5. Accused bishop is arrested for "indecent exposure" without describing his behavior in detail.
(Fact 5 suggests that the bishop was indeed a perv, and therefore lends credibility to the accusations.)
6. Bishop registers as a sex offender and leaves the state. Nevertheless, he sent me a beautiful wedding present. It still gets lots of use.

I think these facts support the family's side of the story.

It sounds as if something went tragically wrong.

And this was at the time when the Church was revising its protocols, which it now has firmly in place. I believe such extenuating circumstances would result in the case not duplicating itself again.