[tooblue]

Originally Posted by Cali Coug

I couldn't disagree more, Tooblue, and I really am shocked you have come to this conclusion. To say that because one would support the killing of a person in a war, they therefore must accept the torture of that person (and any other form of treatment of that person) is a non sequitur.

That is not what I have said or wish to imply. I am saying that there are levels of acceptable moralization going on here, yet ultimately the goal is to kill a fellow human being. It is an incongruence that vexes me. You, I or Mike would prefer to use conventional methods such as bombs and guns. The previous Administration and it's advisors were able to stretch their moralizations to justify torture. But ultimately our goals are the same. Ergo we are the same.

War is to be abhorred, but it may be, from time to time, necessary.

There is no justification for war.

Even so, while engaged in the conduct of war, certain ethical behavior is still required of us.

There is nothing ethical about war. To believe otherwise is folly. The goal of war is death and domination.

We are not permitted to do whatever we fancy in a war to other people simply because they are on the other side of a conflict from us. As sad as the reality of war is, that does not give us a permit to degrade the human form or defile the temple of God however we see fit.

What is more degrading than killing a person and anyone else in the way remotely with an unmanned drone? Arguing ethics at this point is pathetic. Killing is killing, regardless the method. God gave the commandment: thou shalt not kill -- without exceptions. We are not permitted to kill period. However, we are permitted to exercise our agency and choose to kill. All men will answer for their actions.

God has permitted war in many circumstances, so long as the was is being fought with righteous desires.

God has permitted men to exercise agency and therefore wage war. That's not the same as permitting war. You cannot blame God for men's choices. Again, all men will answer for their actions.

I challenge you to find one single solitary example of God condoning torture or the debasement of the human body.

A red herring.